Support Units

[W.Barksdale]

While creating a division of cavalry I tried adding various support units to the division to see how movement varied. Results:

Adding a balloon, medic, signal corps, and engineer units to the stack slows the movement of the stack. However, if included in the divisional structure the stack moves as if it was only cavalry. Is this intended?

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[Jones76]

When creating a Engineer on the recruit panel, it says "ALL States" instead of one particular state like others. What exactly does that mean?

I did try to create one, but don't recall it showing up anywhere the next turn.

[soloswolf]

It means they will show up in any one of your states. Most often in your capital, but almost always in a larger city.

The only times I have seen really silly placement is Marines forming in some small towns.

Service Assets of all kinds are like this as well, and seem to have a higher Capital spawn rate.

[Jabberwock]

This is obviously an oversight that needs to be corrected. Probably need to enlist Pocus help on this one.

NOOoooooooo! Please, take away any of my gamey tactics except that one. leure:

[tyrex]

I've once seen an hospital built in Kaufman as Union. Rather frustrating for me cause I've no offensive intention in this part of land.
It'll be rather interesting to choose wich department we want those assets to appears

[Le Ricain]

I've once seen an hospital built in Kaufman as Union. Rather frustrating for me cause I've no offensive intention in this part of land.
It'll be rather interesting to choose wich department we want those assets to appears

Remember that support units can be teleported using the redeploy function. It really does not matter where they are built.

[GlobalExplorer]

Remember that support units can be teleported using the redeploy function. It really does not matter where they are built.

Whut? I never tried this. I always railway my support units across the country

[Big Muddy]

When this first became an option I used it, but not anymore. I don't even teleport HQ's. I would like to see this done away with, this is the ACW, not star trek. Is it an option or exploit, I wonder what the % would be on how it's used.

[Franciscus]

Remember that support units can be teleported using the redeploy function. It really does not matter where they are built.

I did not know that!!

[lodilefty]

When this first became an option I used it, but not anymore. I don't even teleport HQ's. I would like to see this done away with, this is the ACW, not star trek. Is it an option or exploit, I wonder what the % would be on how it's used.

There's a choice under 'options' at the menu to turn it off.

However, the AI still needs it to resolve issues with Army formation.

[Coffee Sergeant]

Remember that support units can be teleported using the redeploy function. It really does not matter where they are built.

Yes, but you have to wait until they are finished. In a PBEM, had a field hospital show up Dallas and my opponent captured it before I could send reinforcements.

[tyrex]

I never use the teleportation. It's so unrealistic to me that it flaws all savor

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[samwise]

However if teleportation is not an exploit but WAD, what is the rationale of having the option. Is there a historical significance for this ?

[arsan]

However if teleportation is not an exploit but WAD, what is the rationale of having the option. Is there a historical significance for this ?

I don't feel it's gamey... and it certainly aleviates the tedious micromanagement of moving leaders and support from one side of the front to another, as on the vanilla game most leaders and support units appear on yopur capital. But on history it was not like there.
I undertsand that historicaly, to create an army on Nashville, you don't needed to send all the personel (aides, clerks, cooks...) from the capital.
You can send the order by telegraph and gather most of the men from the Tennesse city sorroundings. The same with medics, signal men and the like

When i teleport McCulloch or some medics to Houston i dont think of "Star Trek"... i think of a telegram form the president to the Texas military department saying: "Recall McChulloch from his texas ranch and order him to take comand of the texans forces.. oh, and gather some local doctors to take care of the soldiers"
Also, sending a lone leader to the other side of the country by rail takes the same than sending a full divison with all his assets.
I think the rail movement rates are made thinking of combat units, with all the organizational problems it takes to move thousands of mens, horses, guns, supply, etc.
A leader should be able to go from Richmond to New Orleans on 3/4 days at most, not one month. With the teleport you can do it.

The redeployment is only availible to non combat units, limited to just one use per turn and also gives penalties to the teleported leaders for a turn (jet lag :niark . More than enough for it to not be a gamey trick.
And of course, its of great aid to the AI.

Regards!

[Big Muddy]

There's a choice under 'options' at the menu to turn it off.

However, the AI still needs it to resolve issues with Army formation.

The AI gets three per turn, I don't have a problem with that, especially if there are issues involved with Army formation.

thanks

[Franciscus]

I don't feel it's gamey... and it certainly aleviates the tedious micromanagement of moving leaders and support from one side of the front to another, as on the vanilla game most leaders and support units appear on yopur capital. (...)

Exactly. That is to me a flaw of the vanilla AACW. Besides being tedious, it's plain wrong (historically) and to me a mistery why in vanilla almost all leaders show in the capitals.
That's one of the advantages of the leader mod (to me, the greatest), and also the reason to have used the same redistribution of leaders (but with no new leaders, in order to not mess more with the game files and keep it simple and JSGME compatible), in my own "simple mod" (shameless self-promotion here )

[GlobalExplorer]

I don't find it gamey. In my last game I used the three deployments per turn rule and I am quite happy with it.

Though this makes for an easier game by helping to get enough commanders in the WTO - I don't see where this could be seen as a 'cheat'. Imo the aim of this game is not to carry people all over the country by railroad.

Playing without the redeploy rule makes for a harder game but imvho the devs should not have to rely on these tricks to make the game challenging. Activation rule, negative traits and general lack of generals are much more suited for that.

Also lets not forget the general will have reduced stats after redeployment. If this would be extended to several turns - I would have nothing against it.

[tyrex]

A leader could arrive on the spot in three days ok. But he can't handle troop in such a short time. He has to know his subordinate, the status of this troops and so on.
You can't arrive at the lead and go azap to the battle (well you can but with desastrous results). It takes time to apprehend the mood of troopers. Officers, NCO and troopers have to learn a little bit of each other before going to fire. And it's time consuming.
So the actual time to reach the unit reflect this delay for me.

But after all this teleportation thing is a matter of taste (sorry I'm french and I don't know the exact translation of the locution). Somone would like it. Someone not. As it is optionnal everybody could play as it feels...and that's great

[Le Ricain]

A leader could arrive on the spot in three days ok. But he can't handle troop in such a short time. He has to know his subordinate, the status of this troops and so on.
You can't arrive at the lead and go azap to the battle (well you can but with desastrous results). It takes time to apprehend the mood of troopers. Officers, NCO and troopers have to learn a little bit of each other before going to fire. And it's time consuming.
So the actual time to reach the unit reflect this delay for me.

But after all this teleportation thing is a matter of taste (sorry I'm french and I don't know the exact translation of the locution). Somone would like it. Someone not. As it is optionnal everybody could play as it feels...and that's great

I agree with what you are saying. However, with the game turn lasting 15 days, I think that it would reasonable for a newly arrived commander to become familiar with his command and fight in that time.

[tyrex]

As I said, everyone would have a reason to choose or not an option.
This is just my justification for not using teleportation

The great thing with ACW is that is a great game with many options to satisfy as many peoples as it can.

[Coffee Sergeant]

However if teleportation is not an exploit but WAD, what is the rationale of having the option. Is there a historical significance for this ?

Well according to McPherson it did not take a 2 weeks to go from New york to Chicago in 1860 by rail, more like 2 days.
The rail system is heavily abstracted, so you can sort of justfiy the long transit times for large groups (gotta get all the boys together, provision for the journey, etc.), but for small units you can certainly justify travelling very quickly, almost instanteously. Granted it is a little unrealistic for something like a move from Boston to California, but keep in mind also you don't have control over where leaders spawn. You could think of it as Lincoln/Davis/whoever making a "special request" for a the unit to show up where it should.

[Gray_Lensman]

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[PhilThib]

Warning: one of the reasons we had all the leaders pop-up in the same location (i.e. the capital) was to help the AI-side. It is easier for her to redistribute generals from a central location than to collect them from all over the territory and redistribute them

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[Pocus]

While creating a division of cavalry I tried adding various support units to the division to see how movement varied. Results:

Adding a balloon, medic, signal corps, and engineer units to the stack slows the movement of the stack. However, if included in the divisional structure the stack moves as if it was only cavalry. Is this intended?

WAD
Units don't move at the pace of their slowest element, or all infantry divisions would move at the pace of their artillery (and in mud, wheeled elements crawl...). So there are some advantages purposely done here, like moving to the speed of the line elements if you include support elements within an unit.

[runyan99]

WAD
So there are some advantages purposely done here, like moving to the speed of the line elements if you include support elements within an unit.

Mmm okay but there are exploits too. I can create a cavalry division, and add siege artillery to it, and the artillery does not slow down the division.

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[runyan99]

Maybe siege artillery should somehow be prohibited from merging inside a "Division"?

Not really. The same premise applies to Rodmans or Columbiads, or whatever.