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BigDuke66
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Native Indians regional devisions

Sun Apr 29, 2018 4:00 am

Do I misunderstand them or is something wrong with them?
1. Retaliation
For this it's said that it has to target an Indian unit but I get regions show as eligible although no Indian unit but only an Indian village is there.

2. Indian Reservation
It said that it should target regions with Indian villages but why is for example Colorado City and Santa Fe shown as eligible? There are no Indian villages in these regions.
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Captain_Orso
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Sun Apr 29, 2018 8:56 am

With the current possibilities of Event and Regional Decision scripting one cannot really write the RGD's to work sensibly. In addition, Indian elements all have the exact same faction (IND) until they are taken over through one of the major factions, when they take on that faction's designator.

The only way to assess whether an element actually is 'Indian' is by assessing the element's Attributes parameter having '#IsIndian#', but you still cannot assess whether the element is an enemy element. This is why so many of the Indian RGD's reference whether the target region has an Indian village, because an Indian unit with the USA or CSA faction tag cannot enter such a region. But you can very often find Indian units away from villages, and these will be invisible to the current RGD's.

Indians really should be a complete set of different factions. The term 'Indian Nation' really is an insult to Native American peoples, even as it so 'gracefully' insinuates a sovereignty of these people, it in the same breath designates them as all having the same nationality. It would be like saying all Europeans belong to 'The European Nation' :fleb:

Without the necessary script commands--at the very least--and realistically represented Native American tribes, I would not look any closer into using Indian RGD's. The only one which would have been really useful is Subversion, and it doesn't work. If it did, the others might also come into some importance, but otherwise they are all pointless.

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BigDuke66
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Sun Apr 29, 2018 5:30 pm

Captain_Orso wrote:The only one which would have been really useful is Subversion, and it doesn't work. If it did, the others might also come into some importance, but otherwise they are all pointless.

This disgusting state in which these RGD are is a pity, they should be fixed or removed.
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Captain_Orso
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Tue May 01, 2018 6:32 am

There's no need to remove Indians at this point, you can simply ignore the Indian RGD's and that's that.

The simplest fix--making the Subversion RGD work--would also be the easiest. We would only need a command and or parameter in a current command to evaluate whether target units are neutral--relative to the player who played the RGD--or not. Bingo, you could write the Indian RGD's to only target the correct category of NA units, and all could be made to work correctly.

The deluxe solution would include a simplified version of Wars of Napoleon's diplomacy system, and Native American Tribes, and would actually allow for making some really interesting Indian Wars mini-games :indien:

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Cardinal Ape
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Mon May 07, 2018 7:31 am

BigDuke66 wrote:This disgusting state in which these RGD are is a pity, they should be fixed or removed.


As a man with Lakota blood I was also dissapointed with these RGD's. Though, I wouldn't go as far as you. Instead I get the feeling that the devs had a plan of trying to do something with the tribes but it just didn't get finished.. they left some uncooked meat on the table.

At the least, I am happy that I can get a 6-6-6 Little Crow with the two best scouting regiments in the game, (they don't need food, only ammo) while it may not be accurate it is fun.

Honestly, I've always had the feeling that the ageod devs have a soft spot in their hearts for the Native Americans: I don't think that there is a faction who has better generals on the average then the NAs. 6-6-6, level 5 ambushers are the norm for them.
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BigDuke66
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Mon May 07, 2018 6:43 pm

Cardinal Ape wrote: Instead I get the feeling that the devs had a plan of trying to do something with the tribes but it just didn't get finished.. they left some uncooked meat on the table.

Unfortunately that fits to many parts of the game.
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Bamilus
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Mon Jul 29, 2019 10:41 pm

Sorry for necro, but didnt want to start new thread.

Im playing USA vs CSA Athena and either late 1862 or early 1863 (cant remember which) I noticed that both arizona boxes were taken over by "neutral" Apache indians, even though I had 100% military control and a garrisoned stockade. Is this a scripted event or did I get unlucky on some random Indian uprising event?

The problem is I could handle the one Indian but I'm the western Arizona box I cant do anything. My troops cant change military control and I cant play any RGDs. This is annoying because its blocking my California supply. Is this WAD or is there an edit I can make to fix this?

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DrPostman
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:15 pm

It's the Sioux Uprising of 1862 event. They are no longer neutral. They will turn back
to neutral sometime in 1863. It's a bug since it was only something that happened in
the Minnesota River valley. You can use your Subvert Indians regional decision card
to try to turn them into union assets or attack them while they are still hostile. As
mentioned earlier in this thread the game treats all natives as a single faction unless
they are part of the CSA or the USA faction.

If there ever is a AGEOD Civil War 3 I hope the devs can do something about multiple
sides for the natives. I know that's a big ask but it would be awesome if they can.

Bamilus
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:41 pm

It's not the Sioux event, that event happens in Minnesota. This is Apache/Hopi in Arizona. Sioux were never in that part of the country.

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DrPostman
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Thu Aug 01, 2019 4:57 am

Bamilus wrote:It's not the Sioux event, that event happens in Minnesota. This is Apache/Hopi in Arizona. Sioux were never in that part of the country.


Yet they turn hostile when the Sioux event fires. That's why I said it's a bug. Was there an Apache/Hopi
uprising at the same time?

Bamilus
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Re: Native Indians regional devisions

Thu Aug 01, 2019 3:56 pm

DrPostman wrote:
Bamilus wrote:It's not the Sioux event, that event happens in Minnesota. This is Apache/Hopi in Arizona. Sioux were never in that part of the country.


Yet they turn hostile when the Sioux event fires. That's why I said it's a bug. Was there an Apache/Hopi
uprising at the same time?


Sorry, I didn't know you were talking about the bug. Yea, I'm assuming there was since it happened in both of the Arizona territories that have Apache tribes, but I didn't save the log. It's just frustrating they can take a garrisoned stockade instantly with no fight and then sit there as neutral preventing all supply.

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