Something very interesting I just noticed regarding leader nationality...

[bob.]

I have been playing this game since release, and there are still things I notice now and then that I had no idea about before...

a few moments ago, I noticed this oddity: if you assign a leader to a unit, he seems to automatically assume the nationality of the unit! This gets rid of command penalties.

An example (Caesar vs. Pompey)

Ahenobarbus, one of Pompey's goons, together with two hellenistic units:
because of the different nationality, as we all know, command penalty applies. Instead of 4 CP the stack needs 4 * 4 = 16 CP.


But now I assign Ahenobarbus to the Sagittarii and the command penalty disappears:


Doesn't seem very logical to me... this means that for example, if you have a large army that contains troops without leaders of their natonality, just assign one leader of another nationality to one of their units and the penalty disappears!

[Jagger2013]

I just noticed something similiar a couple days ago in the Septimius Severus scenario and reported it in the Improve AJE forum. It turns out if I merge an out of region leader with one of his own units, the merging cancels the out of region penalty. After merging, the leader will have normal leadership values and his out of region icon stops flashing. Definitely shouldn't happen. Bohemond said he will check into it.

[Bohémond]

Well, I wil ltry to clarify and explain with my limited knowlwdge of the engine.

Command Cost penalty are applied for Faction B if leaders belongs to Faction A and if Faction B is not a CoopTag ( a Faction Parameter) for Faction A.

When you merge a leader unit with a non leader unit ( + Special Order), the leader unit is removed and the leader Sub unit is embedded into the (ex) non leaders unit. Leader ''lose'' his faction.

Same mechanism for AreaBound penalty. The penalty is attached to leader unit, as soon as this unit is ''removed'' and the leader is embedded in a new unit, the penalty is removed.

Hope it's clear and that I do not say anything wrong.

Regards

[Jagger2013]

Bohemond, is there a fix for the removal of out of area leadership penalties by merging with a combat unit? It seems merging with a combat unit to remove OOA leadership penalties violates the intention/spirit of out of area penalties.

Although I imagine we could use house rules temporarily to avoid the problem. Simply don't merge leaders with combat units when out of area-unless a superior commander, without out of area leadership penalties, is in charge of the stack.

[bob.]

Turns out actually the command penalty still applies if this leader+unit is led by another leader. So, it's really not a big deal.

[Jagger2013]

Bob is that correct? From what I can see, the out of theater commander recieves a penalty to attack, defense and strategic ratings when out of their home theater. To me, the biggest drawback is the reduction in strategic ratings. In my current game, Septimius Severus AJE, the commanders out of theater will have strategic activation ratings of 1 or 2. Which means as independent stack commanders, they rarely activate which really reduces their effectiveness. Basically they become very slow, defensive stacks with significant combat penalties due to the rarity of command activation.

In the AJE Severus scenario, most of the two and three star eastern commanders, with out of theater penalties, are very senior. Only two roman commanders are senior enough to become stack commanders over these eastern armies. So those eastern armies cannot be used as independent stacks under their own commanders out of theater without command penalties unless you put them directly under the command of one of the two senior roman commanders.

But if you merge any of those out of theater commanders with any of their own units, the out of theater penalty disappears, the out of theater commander still has command and they act as perfectly normal independent stacks-just as if they were fighting in their home theaters. A definite improvement in ability which bypasses the intended result of out of region penalties.

[bob.]

Sorry Jagger, I worded that terribly. I meant only the issue that I was talking about in my first post, not the theatre penalty.

[Jagger2013]

Sorry Jagger, I worded that terribly. I meant only the issue that I was talking about in my first post, not the theatre penalty.

No problem. I misunderstood. I thought perhaps you saw something I had missed.