March to the sound of gun and river crossing

[Mickey3D]

I read a lot about MTSG but there is one question I've never found an answer to :

Is MTSG allowed if there is a river between the two involved regions AND an ennemy fleet is on the river ?

In other words, an ennemy fleet has a chance to block movement accross river. Does this apply to MTSG too ?

[Pocus]

Yes, the full extent of the path-finding algorithm applies here, so you can block MTSG with ships. But it works for others cases too. Lets picture 3 regions:

B: the battle region, with a CSA railroad.
R: the reinforcement region, with a CSA railroad
Between B and R, a river, controlled by the Union.

Finally, T, a third region, adjacent to B and R, with a CSA railroad.

Guess what, the Rebels troops if the river is interdicted and if there is enough remaining rail pool will board the train and move from R to T then B to get into battle!

As a reminder, the probability of joining MTSG is reduced by 10% per day needed to get into the battle region (this is an abstract calculation and they don't really appears days after the battle or this would serve nothing). So if the path cost is high, they will never join. If the path cost is short enough, they may... That's also why it is good to have troops sitting in railroad regions with enough spare points in the rail pool.

[Mickey3D]

Thanks a lot for your answer and your example that opens new horizon to AACW strategy !

[andatiep]

True ! That really opens new horizon to AACW strategy...

I have new questions about it :

- Without the river problem, with only two regions concerned, if i let enough rail transport in the global pool, will any of my corps react better and do a MTSG (if railway and military control in the both regions) ? Is it a good tips to always let enough rail transport for your main corps so that they have only 1 day malus (10%) to do a MTSG (next to the other strategic value malus/bonus of the generals of course) ?

- Does in work also with the fluvial transport ?


I linked this thread in the AACW strategy guide in the wiki (http://www.ageod.net/aacwwiki/AACW_strategy_guide#Tips_about_March_to_the_sound_of_the_guns.22) but if there is already a TODO list for AACW2, please add that this features of the game should really appear in the AACW2 Manual.

[Pocus]

You will have to plan ahead and give to the corps either the rail move mode or the river move mode or both, the hosting phase won't switch by itself the corps to this special move even if you have points in reserve.

[Jim-NC]

This just means you have to plan better to be able to use it (or get lucky on guessing which turn you will be attacked).

Now if I only had an unlimited source of WS to make my dreams real. Oh well, back to reality and limited WS.

[Mickey3D]

Guess what, the Rebels troops if the river is interdicted and if there is enough remaining rail pool will board the train and move from R to T then B to get into battle!

You will have to plan ahead and give to the corps either the rail move mode or the river move mode or both, the hosting phase won't switch by itself the corps to this special move even if you have points in reserve.

I'm perhaps misunderstanding but for me these two answers a contradictory

[beatoangelico]

from what I understand you can have a stationary stack with rail move selected and that stack could move by rail during the resolution phase if called by "the sound of the guns"

[caranorn]

Even if you have to manually chose the mode that's really interesting news (yes, been playing AACW again the past week). Of course you can't always afford this, but sometimes when danger appears imminent it might be worth the cost (less supply shifting)...

[Pocus]

I got carried away yes... I first saw that rail move would be of use, but then answering a second time I realized that rail move could only be used if it was activated...

[andatiep]

So finally, for the one like me who painfully understand english, is this formulation the good one ? =>

from what I understand you can have a stationary stack with rail move [order] selected and that stack could move by rail during the resolution phase if called by "the sound of the guns"

<EDIT> ...and about the question : is it working also with the fluvial/naval transport ?

[Mickey3D]

So finally, for the one like me who painfully understand english, is this formulation the good one ? =>




<EDIT> ...and about the question : is it working also with the fluvial/naval transport ?

Based on second answer from Pocus I would say yes to both questions.

[Tobi]

You will have to plan ahead and give to the corps either the rail move mode or the river move mode or both, the hosting phase won't switch by itself the corps to this special move even if you have points in reserve.

totay one of my armies supported one of my corps one hex away...
i had no move by ship or move by raild selected.. (i loaded last turn orders to check)

in the replay it doesn't do anything for 8 days (like ordered)... then after the battle.. the army moves on the river... arrives there and starts moving back to the locatione where it started but doesn't arrive there bevor the turn is over..

so i know i have an army on the river with move by rail and move by ship selected..

i asume thats a bug?

[caranorn]

totay one of my armies supported one of my corps one hex away...
i had no move by ship or move by raild selected.. (i loaded last turn orders to check)

in the replay it doesn't do anything for 8 days (like ordered)... then after the battle.. the army moves on the river... arrives there and starts moving back to the locatione where it started but doesn't arrive there bevor the turn is over..

so i know i have an army on the river with move by rail and move by ship selected..

i asume thats a bug?

No, in the replay you often see forces moving towards a neighbouring region (you see the increments moved). Also, march to the sound of the guns doesn't necessitate (don't try writing a foreign language right after you've returned from Pizza with 1 glass of Port, 1/4l red and a Limoncello ;-) ) the rail or ship move selected, having those selected can only improve the chances, but any army/corps one region away from another army/corps of the same amry can react that way, though the time it would take for a regular move determines the probability of success (short time greater chance)...

P.S.: I really should reply to posts at least an hour after going to the local italian ;-) ...

[Tobi]

can it be that if Corps join a battle in an adjacent regione they stay in the region where they started.. and you have to manuel select move by rail or ship to increase chance..

and if army hqs join a batlle in adjacent region that they also move there
and auto select move by rail and move by ship?

that would explain what happend

(and sry for my bad english)


edit:

i just tested it by replacing the army hq with an corps...
seems what i posted above is right but i think it shouldn't be that way..
sometimes the army hq doesn't arrive bevor the round is over..
also it use an river that isn't save...

also the union troops cannot retreat for some reason in the situation i tested if the army hq moves to the battle locatione... (3 regions with 100% military control adjacent)
if just a corp joins they can retreat without any problem...

[caranorn]

1)can it be that if Corps join a battle in an adjacent regione they stay in the region where they started.. and you have to manuel select move by rail or ship to increase chance..

2)and if army hqs join a batlle in adjacent region that they also move there
3)and auto select move by rail and move by ship?

that would explain what happend

(and sry for my bad english)

1) Yes!
2) Possible at least in RoP, at least I've seen some armies and maybe columns in that game actually move to a region via March to the soudn of the Guns...
3) Don't think so...

P.S.: No problem with your english, right now I'm also struggling and I can at least in theory write professional english (as in fiction novbel writing)...

[Tobi]

3) Don't think so...

they do...
i tested some more... and so far i got the army hq joining the battle without moving there... the army hq not joining the battle..
and the army hq joining the battle by moving there by using a river and switiching to move by river and rail (takes part in battle, but arrives in the hex where the battle takes place way after battle, sometimes not even in the same turn)


here are some files to show that:
(don't wonder why troops are starving and are in strange position.. i used a old file of the game i play and just set up those battle)

i had to resolve those turns a few times until i catched both armies on the river... (thats why smith moves around per rail bevor attacking)
so that people can see that the armies switched to move by rail and move by ship...ussally they arrive bevor the turn is over
(btw i looks like they are moving back in the hex where they started... but if you move them you will notice that that is displayed wrong.. they moving in the hex where the battle did take place)

in bbbb that happens in Kentucky... notice the union army cannot retreat for some strange reason! 2 Hex with 100% miltary controll close...
but if you load the backup and move the army hq away so that it cannot join
then the union army can retreat
EDIT: actuall thats not true.. Union army cannot retreat then too...
hmmm can someone explain me why? i though when you have an adjected Hex with 100% military controll you can always retreat?

in cccc it happens in virginia, union army cannot retreat too, but this time it is because they controll no Hex close (tried to also create a battle there where they can retreat to a Hex close... but somehow Lee refuse in that caese to move per river)

[soundoff]

can it be that if Corps join a battle in an adjacent regione they stay in the region where they started.. and you have to manuel select move by rail or ship to increase chance..

and if army hqs join a batlle in adjacent region that they also move there
and auto select move by rail and move by ship?

that would explain what happend

Hi Tobi,

Marching to the Sound of the Guns is something of an abstraction and works like this.

If a Corp or Army HQ is engaged in combat then other Corps or Army HQ have the potential of marching to the sound of the guns providing that:

1. They are all part of the same Army.

2. They are in a region adjacent to the region in which the battle is taking place.


Provided both of these conditions are met there is then the following chance of marching to the sound of the guns happening. It starts of at a base 100% chance of but then gets modified.

-10% for each day of march it would normally have taken the Corp or Army HQ to reach the region in which the battle takes place

+25% if the force attempting to march to the sound of the guns is an Army HQ

+10% if the Corp attempting to march to the sound of the guns is adjacent
to an Army HQ

+5% for each strategic rating point of the Corp or Army commander

-10% if the force attempting to MTSG is in defensive mode

-1% for every 5% of military control lacking in both the start and end regions.

So for example lets say we have an Army HQ attempting to MTSG and lets further assume that it would have taken us 7 days to move from the region the Army HQ is in to the region in which the battle is happening were we just to have entered in a move order. Lets further assume just so we do not complicate things that we have 100% military control of the region that the Army HQ is in but only 50% military control of the region the battle is taking place in. Finally our Army commander has a strategic rating of 5 and the Army is in defensive posture.

Remember the Corp being attacked has to be attached to the same Army HQ thats trying to MTSG and the Army HQ has to be in a region adjacent to the Corp.

If those two criteria are met then from the information we have we can work out our chances.

The Army HQ has a 100% chance of Marching to the Sound of the Guns less 70% for each of the days it would normally have taken the Army to move to the region (7 days at minus 10% per day). That reduces it to 30%. But its an Army HQ and Army HQs get plus 25%. So now we have a 55% chance of MTSG. But we've still not finished. Our Army commander has a strategic rating of 5. For each point of strategic rating we get an additional 5% so thats another 25% chance we can add back. Now we are 55% plus 25% - a nice 80% chance of it happening.

Still a bit more to do though. Our Army HQ is in defensive mode so we have got to subtract 10% and although we have 100% military control in the region the Army HQ is currently in we have only 50% military control in the region in which the battle is taking place. As we lose 1% for every 5% of control we lack thats a further 10% we have to take off.

So now our chances of MTSG have been reduced from 80% to 60% - still better than even.

The program rolls the dice and if it falls within that 60% then our Army HQ marches to the sound of the guns. Takes part in the battle then goes back to the region it started in.

There are a couple of additional points to bear in mind

1. If your Army or Corp is in passive mode it is considered unable to MTSG

2. If your Army or Corp commander is inactive it will not MTSG


Sorry for being long winded but I hope the above helps.

If you attempt to actually put a movement order in for an Army HQ or a Corp to get it to the region in which the battle is going to take place you will NOT march to the sound of the guns. You just move to the region. If your movement gets you there before the battle occurs then your force will take part. If it gets there a day or two late it will miss the battle.

[Tobi]

The program rolls the dice and if it falls within that 60% then our Army HQ marches to the sound of the guns. Takes part in the battle then goes back to the region it started in.

see but my army hq switches (without me ordering it) to move by rail and move by ship
moves on the river and moves in the region where the battle takes place and stays there
sometimes (like in the files posted above) it doesn't even arrive bevor the round is over...

If you attempt to actually put a movement order in for an Army HQ or a Corp to get it to the region in which the battle is going to take place you will NOT march to the sound of the guns. You just move to the region. If your movement gets you there before the battle occurs then your force will take part. If it gets there a day or two late it will miss the battle.

i didn't order to move it... as said it moves there without me ordering it
the movment you can see in the replay files is not ordered by me

[Krec]

sound off, great reply, nice and clear . thanks

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[Tobi]

Doesn't matter if you order it to move or not. If it's responding to a MTSG situation it will move using rail or river movement IF you have the extra pool capacity available. See Pocus' reply in Post #2 above.

see Porcus post 5....
maybe i do understand that one wrong.


also if a corp of a HQ MTSG it is immidetly in the region where the fight takes place... and immidetly back in the region where it was located bevor the fight when the fight is over...
those rail or river movment just would increase the chance of doing MTSG
or do it get that wrong?

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[Jim-NC]

they do...
i tested some more... and so far i got the army hq joining the battle without moving there... the army hq not joining the battle..
and the army hq joining the battle by moving there by using a river and switiching to move by river and rail (takes part in battle, but arrives in the hex where the battle takes place way after battle, sometimes not even in the same turn)


here are some files to show that:
(don't wonder why troops are starving and are in strange position.. i used a old file of the game i play and just set up those battle)

i had to resolve those turns a few times until i catched both armies on the river... (thats why smith moves around per rail bevor attacking)
so that people can see that the armies switched to move by rail and move by ship...ussally they arrive bevor the turn is over
(btw i looks like they are moving back in the hex where they started... but if you move them you will notice that that is displayed wrong.. they moving in the hex where the battle did take place)

in bbbb that happens in Kentucky... notice the union army cannot retreat for some strange reason! 2 Hex with 100% miltary controll close...
but if you load the backup and move the army hq away so that it cannot join
then the union army can retreat
EDIT: actuall thats not true.. Union army cannot retreat then too...
hmmm can someone explain me why? i though when you have an adjected Hex with 100% military controll you can always retreat?

in cccc it happens in virginia, union army cannot retreat too, but this time it is because they controll no Hex close (tried to also create a battle there where they can retreat to a Hex close... but somehow Lee refuse in that caese to move per river)

In the KY area, I assume you mean Banks' army. He has emplaced coastal artillery in the 1 division. This causes him to have a 2900+ day travel time between regions. I don't think he can possibly retreat with that long of a travel time. You seem to have forced something weird. The coastal guns show that they can not move from the region. I think you may have stumbled on the rare case of forcing emplaced guns to retreat (not capturing). It appears that Bank's slow mover combines with the artillery to make these absurd movement times. If I pull out the artillery, and it plots a movement of 35 days, when you add Banks it becomes 3000. It is Banks and the coastal artillery. If you remove him from the army, or keep him in, it makes no difference, it takes 3000 days to move.

I am not sure if this is a bug or a WAD.

To test the lack of retreat, I would suggest removing the coastal guns from Banks' army and rerunning the test (I would bet you won't get the same retreat failure).

[soundoff]

In the KY area, I assume you mean Banks' army. He has emplaced coastal artillery in the 1 division. This causes him to have a 2900+ day travel time between regions. I don't think he can possibly retreat with that long of a travel time. You seem to have forced something weird. The coastal guns show that they can not move from the region. I think you may have stumbled on the rare case of forcing emplaced guns to retreat (not capturing). It appears that Bank's slow mover combines with the artillery to make these absurd movement times. If I pull out the artillery, and it plots a movement of 35 days, when you add Banks it becomes 3000. It is Banks and the coastal artillery. If you remove him from the army, or keep him in, it makes no difference, it takes 3000 days to move.

I am not sure if this is a bug or a WAD.

To test the lack of retreat, I would suggest removing the coastal guns from Banks' army and rerunning the test (I would bet you won't get the same retreat failure).

Hi Tobi

Jim-NC has about put his finger on the problem. For starters the early July turn does not match up with the late July one but never mind.

With the early July turn in Virginia you have the Army of the Potomac with McClellan taking too long to move because the 41st Division that is attached to him has coastal artillery in it. Now coastal artillery does not move very fast - its not intended to be located in divisions that you move. Its primary function is to do what it says.....be a coastal artillery battery. So site them in your ocean forts. Dont put them in divisions that you move about with.

With the late July turn as Jim-NC has said there is a problem with coastal artillery combined with a slow mover commander such as Nathaniel Banks and you have coastal artillery in the 42nd Division in the Army of Tennessee.

Try the following. Remove the 42nd Division complete. Then see what difference it makes to the Armys move. You will see that Banks can now make his march in 14 days. But it gets better. Banks is a slow mover so lets remove him from the Army. That reduces the march time to 9 days even though we only have a two star general leading.

Lets also look at that 42nd Division that was within the Army of Tennessee. On its own the time it takes to make the move has been significantly reduced but it is still over 14 days. So lets take one of those spare 2 star commanders you have in the Army of Tennessee and give them overall command of the 42nd. Much better. We get there quicker as we get rid of the command penalty.

Remember and repeat after me....... COASTAL ARTILLERY IS FOR COASTAL DEFENCE ONLY

There is such a lot to remember in AACW. The learning curve is very steep but I'm sure you will get there. We all went through it. And AACW is well worth while persevering with. Good luck and keep asking the questions


P.S. I will concede that in the move with the Army of Tennessee there is a bug with the Banks/Coastal Artillery movement combination but its not a game breaker.

[Tobi]

It is not "immediate". It is calculated to move to the region using normal movement rules as if you actually gave it orders.

as far as i get it the travel time just get used to calculate the probability if MTSG happens or not
but if MTSG happens the Corps or Hq takes part in the battle immediate..
else the army or HQ would arrive way after battle is over most of the times.
might be the same you just tried to say.. not sure

It will use rail and/or river movement as necessary to make the move, (if you have the excess points left in the rail or river pool to utilize).

again i might be wrong because of my english
but Porcus post 5 and 10 in this thread
doesn't he say something totally different?

Once the battle is over, it is returned to the region it started in.

immediate



which brings me back to my caese..
the army hq moves there without beeing returned after the battle.
and it arrives at the region where the battle takes places days (sometimes even a round) after the battle...

In the KY area, I assume you mean Banks' army. He has emplaced coastal artillery in the 1 division. This causes him to have a 2900+ day travel time between regions. I don't think he can possibly retreat with that long of a travel time. You seem to have forced something weird. The coastal guns show that they can not move from the region. I think you may have stumbled on the rare case of forcing emplaced guns to retreat (not capturing). It appears that Bank's slow mover combines with the artillery to make these absurd movement times. If I pull out the artillery, and it plots a movement of 35 days, when you add Banks it becomes 3000. It is Banks and the coastal artillery. If you remove him from the army, or keep him in, it makes no difference, it takes 3000 days to move.

I am not sure if this is a bug or a WAD.

To test the lack of retreat, I would suggest removing the coastal guns from Banks' army and rerunning the test (I would bet you won't get the same retreat failure).

they can retreat when i remove the guns in "bbbb"...
but stay and fight to dead if i don't remove them
but they also can retreat in the file "cccc" with the guns
thats what i did fail to understand
sometimes he even arrives in Boone in Ky bevor the round is over if he retreats. (while i tested around yesterday it did happen at least 2 times)

(i made a extra thread for that questione yesterday...
thought it doesn't fit in here
http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=17768 )

For starters the early July turn does not match up with the late July one but never mind.

you mean file bbbb with cccc?
you have two turns in each file... klick on the save file and Pos1 or home or however that key is called to load the backup and to see my move orders..
those should match
and yes bbbb doesn't match with cccc...
but as said it just tried to create a similiar situatione in cccc in virgina to show that it is not because of the region

With the early July turn in Virginia you have the Army of the Potomac with McClellan taking too long to move because the 41st Division that is attached to him has coastal artillery in it. Now coastal artillery does not move very fast - its not intended to be located in divisions that you move. Its primary function is to do what it says.....be a coastal artillery battery. So site them in your ocean forts. Dont put them in divisions that you move about with.

McClellan doesn't even take part in any battle in both files...
i think i fail to explain my point since noone is adressing it
make sure you load the CSA site in cccc or in bbbb because if you load union site you wont see Lees move in cccc and Johnsons in bbbb because it gets displayed wrong... also be aware that there movment target gets displayed wrong... Lee is not moving to Fridricksburg in cccc
also in cccc the union force in virgina gets slaughtered because he has no places to move close.. but thats normal. i'm not coplaining about that.. just lees army Hq move in cccc

if you don't find that unordered movement by lee in cccc (or be Johnsoon in bbbb) strange tell me..
then i give up

With the late July turn as Jim-NC has said there is a problem with coastal artillery combined with a slow mover commander such as Nathaniel Banks and you have coastal artillery in the 42nd Division in the Army of Tennessee.

Try the following. Remove the 42nd Division complete. Then see what difference it makes to the Armys move. You will see that Banks can now make his march in 14 days. But it gets better. Banks is a slow mover so lets remove him from the Army. That reduces the march time to 9 days even though we only have a two star general leading.

Lets also look at that 42nd Division that was within the Army of Tennessee. On its own the time it takes to make the move has been significantly reduced but it is still over 14 days. So lets take one of those spare 2 star commanders you have in the Army of Tennessee and give them overall command of the 42nd. Much better. We get there quicker as we get rid of the command penalty.

Remember and repeat after me....... COASTAL ARTILLERY IS FOR COASTAL DEFENCE ONLY

There is such a lot to remember in AACW. The learning curve is very steep but I'm sure you will get there. We all went through it. And AACW is well worth while persevering with. Good luck and keep asking the questions


P.S. I will concede that in the move with the Army of Tennessee there is a bug with the Banks/Coastal Artillery movement combination but its not a game breaker.

ah i see now
ignore banks in the late July file (cccc)...
and watch Lee at Friedricksburg
ignore Lees battle in the early July file (bbbb) and watch Johnson movmenent in Kentucky

oh and i may point out that i play the CSA site in that pbem

but thnx for the help everyone
i just think you don't get my problem so far :/
sry for the long post

[soundoff]

Hi Tobi,

Ah Ah.....I did not look to see whether there was a backup file. Got it.

Now as regards Lee in your second file I'm not sure I can help you with that as I have only your orders not your opponents.

But with the first one.....Johnston in Kentucky we might have an answer.

Let me begin by saying that I cannot get the program to work other than as intended. I process the late June turn and when Smith attacks sometimes Johnston MTSG and sometimes he does not. More times than most he gets to join the battle but not always. Just as you would expect. Now when you look at the screen just after the battle is finished yes you get the rail and the river icons up above his portraits head. Thats just the computers way of getting him back to where he started from. When you actually look at his picture when the turn is finally finished they are gone. He's not on water or on the railroad at all nor are those movement icons selected. He is back where he started. (At least the 10 times plus that I tried it)

For some reason however, and I do not know why as I cannot reproduce it, in your early July turn Johnston has orders to move back to the region he started from by a combination of rail and river. Yet he's already there. I presume you clicked on the river and rail movement icons when doing your early July orders.

If you click off the move by river and rail icons and just pick up Johnstons graphic and drop it back in the region you will see he's where he should be. He needs no orders at all. However because he is being told to move back to a region he is already in it has caused a glitch for its showing he's going to take 8 days which is false.


As I said I cannot reproduce that early July state for Johnstons Army but as you have already entered your orders I assume you entered movement orders for his army thinking him to be either on the river or on the railroad.


Does that answer at least part of your question? I hope so

[Tobi]

Now as regards Lee in your second file I'm not sure I can help you with that as I have only your orders not your opponent.

i gave the US troops no orders... no need, wont change anything i think
or do you get problems with the ai then?
you can turn ai of in options

Let me begin by saying that I cannot get the program to work other than as intended. I process the late June turn and when Smith attacks sometimes Johnston MTSG and sometimes he does not. More times than most he gets to join the battle but not always. Just as you would expect. Now when you look at the screen just after the battle is finished yes you get the rail and the river icons up above his portraits head. Thats just the computers way of getting him back to where he started from. When you actually look at his picture when the turn is finally finished they are gone. He's not on water or on the railroad at all nor are those movement icons selected. He is back where he started. (At least the 10 times plus that I tried it)

try to move him.. as said it gets displayed wrong...
he is in louisville

For some reason however, and I do not know why as I cannot reproduce it, in your early July turn Johnston has orders to move back to the region he started from by a combination of rail and river. Yet he's already there. I presume you clicked on the river and rail movement icons when doing your early July orders.

no i didn't klick on river and rail movement..
i gave him no orders

also he isn't moving back to the region he started..
again it is displayed wrong... he is moving to louisville
just move him and you will see

round just was over bevor arriving there... what you get is that he arrived in louisville bevor round is over... (displayed as beeing still where he started)
thats also the reason why my corp is moving around per rail bevor battle.. to start the battle later in the round..

If you click off the move by river and rail icons and just pick up Johnstons graphic and drop it back in the region you will see he's where he should be. He needs no orders at all. However because he is being told to move back to a region he is already in it has caused a glitch for its showing he's going to take 8 days which is false.

he needs those 8 days back because he is on the way to louisville
drag him to louisville and you will see that he needs 8 days to get there
or 1 day if you don't unselect move by rail or ship...

As I said I cannot reproduce that early July state for Johnstons Army but as you have already entered your orders I assume you entered movement orders for his army thinking him to be either on the river or on the railroad.

as said he had no orders...
thats why i did gave the backup file..

Does that answer at least part of your question? I hope so

questione remains but now at least you see what i find so strange :P

[soundoff]

Hi Tobi,

Yes you are right. There is a bug somewhere in your game. Most unusual. It will need Pocus to sort it out so you will need to send the files to him.

For those looking in on this thread after much testing what I've discovered in the file Tobi submitted is basically as follows.

At the end of June the picture in Kentucky looks like this.






When you process the turn, providing the Army of Tennessee MTSG you get something like this.






Note from the picture that Johnston most certainly MTSG


Now the interesting bit and the bug. My early July start up looks like this.







On first glance Johnston seems to be where he ought to be. Back in Meade. But on closer investigation......look what it says under his Army stats. He might be showing in Meade but he is actually still in Jefferson. As soon as you pick up the Johnston portrait it moves to Jefferson or else gives you a time to march to Meade.









This final picture is Tobi's own Early July start position.










See how it differs from the Early July result I obtained. In many ways its even worse. It shows Johnston apparently in Meade but according to the Army information he's moving from Meade to Jefferson yet it looks as if he's moving to Meade. In addition both the rail and the river icons are activated although no orders have been entered.

So yes Tobi you have a problem and one that you should not have. I suspect that in some way you have corrupted files but how or why is beyond me. Best of luck in getting it fixed.


That it took me some time to pick it up was because I simply kept processing the turn and looking at the result from the map. When you just look at the picture everything seems to be as it should. Its only when you open up the detail box in relation to the force that it becomes apparent that all is not well.

[Tobi]

See how it differs from the Early July result I obtained. In many ways its even worse. It shows Johnston apparently in Meade but according to the Army information he's moving from Meade to Jefferson yet it looks as if he's moving to Meade. In addition both the rail and the river icons are activated although no orders have been entered.

So yes Tobi you have a problem and one that you should not have. I suspect that in some way you have corrupted files but how or why is beyond me. Best of luck in getting it fixed.


That it took me some time to pick it up was because I simply kept processing the turn and looking at the result from the map. When you just look at the picture everything seems to be as it should. Its only when you open up the detail box in relation to the force that it becomes apparent that all is not well.

first of all big thnx

should have thought about explaining it with pictures myself

btw picture 3 and 4 show the same situatione... just picture 3 is a few days laster as picture 4 i think..
i asume you use no battle delay as optione?
that might explain why your Johnson already arrived and my not
(i used the second optione in battle delay i think.. i'm at a different pc now, so i cannot check)

sometimes Johnson also moves per river there... (probatly he use the shortest path.. so when there is mud....)
and if you time the battle right you can catch him on the river...




anyway its not a big deal.. (luckly he missed the union fleet by a few days )
just wanted to ask if that is normal and to report it

first i thought that movement resulted in Banks not be abel to retreat
(which gave me in my eyes 12 undeserved moral points.. don't want to win that way)
but while it is true that the strange movement by Johnson only happens when Banks cannot retreat
(you seem to need at least 2 battles in a regione to have it happen.. if there is just one battle MSTG works fine)
Bank also sometimes fails to retreat when Johnson doesn't join...
seems to be random..
anyway i already asked that in another thread