English Civil War game

[redcoat2]

I think that your ‘game engine’ is great for the American Revolution and American Civil War periods – and so I believe that it would be just as good for an English Civil War (ECW) game.

The ECW is very well suited to a regional (counties and major cities) game map – and the loyalty of different regions could be easily modelled by your game system. Many different scenarios could be designed for an ECW game – ranging from a ‘grand campaign’ for the whole period to different scenarios for different years.

I’m not sure how commercial such a game would be though. I haven’t heard of any other computer game that covers the ECW – and so such a game could establish a new niche in the market.

[Le Ricain]

Well, there is the argument that the games that AGEOD have done or are doing, BoA and AACW, plus the ECW are the three wars that defined both the USA and Great Britain. These three wars divided both countries socially and geographically almost exactly down the same lines each time. For example, East Anglia supported Parliament in ECW, the Americans in the AWI and the North in the ACW. The Midlands, on the other hand, supported the King, the British government and South.

In America, during the ECW, New England supported Parliament, the middle states were divided and the South supported the King. Substituting the words 'Parliament' and 'King' in the previous sentence with 'American' or ' Loyalist' or 'North' and 'South' and all three wars fall into a pattern.

The AWI has been called the second English Civil War and the ACW has been called the third ECW.

[Sol Invictus]

I would certainly enjoy an ECW game using this engine; but I'm a military history fanatic. Maybe at some point down the road they might get around to covering the ECW, but there are bigger fish to fry in the next few years.

[redcoat2]

[quote="Sol Invictus"]I would certainly enjoy an ECW game using this engine]
I’m a military history fanatic as well – which is why I’m interested in the English Civil War. I imagine that the ECW isn’t very well known outside the UK though.

I understand that AGEOD may have ‘bigger fish’ to fry – but I think that an ECW game could be created quite quickly using the existing game engine. Moreover, they could be the first people to create a computer game covering the war.

[Ashbery76]

ECW wouldn't sell much at all, so it's unlikely that AGEOD would even consider making it.I would play the royalist side if it was.

[Pocus]

We have considered the subject, but it can only be done as a side-project as we would surely lose money (that we don't have ) if we were doing it otherwise. Definitively an interesting subject though. The AGE engine is versatile enough to allow us to do that, I confirm.

[PhilThib]

I imagine that the ECW isn’t very well known outside the UK though.
--- but I think that an ECW game could be created quite quickly using the existing game engine. Moreover, they could be the first people to create a computer game covering the war.

This could be done indeed. We can get the historical sources easily, and adapt the engine. The problem is the graphics, which we have to rework and pay for. This is a budget of 10-12,000 euros we do not have right now... unless we find a fan who wish to partner with us and help us do that

[Pocus]

It has to be noted that BOA has been budgeted thanks to an handful players, who are now 'associates'. They leased between 1,000 and 5,000 $ each. If you are interested in this kind of partnership, just contact us.

[kafka]

It has to be noted that BOA has been budgeted thanks to an handful players, who are now 'associates'. They leased between 1,000 and 5,000 $ each. If you are interested in this kind of partnership, just contact us.

interesting approach!

Just a note: I'm one of those who are strongly interested in a game set in the WW2 european theatre which combines the strategic and operational levels as in War in The Pacific by 2by3 (published by Matrixgames). There is nothing like that in development as far as I know. There are some games like HOI2 and SC2 which cover the grand strategy level only and the the edition of TOAW by matrixgames which covers the operational level only. But there is none which models both aspects as does WiTP for the pacific theatre. 2by3 has worked on a remake of War in Russia but has halted this project so there is absoluteliy nothing of this kind in development now. I suppose that there might be a lot of people interested in such kind of partnership to support the development of such a game. Anyway why not contact matrixgames for a concert effort to make such a project real?
On the other hand, I'm a programmer myself though not a game programmer and have thought of starting such a project myself based on some open source game development farmework (like allegro or clanlib) but dropped this because of it cannot possibly be a one-man work. But I'd definetely be willing to give hands in whatever possible way (research, graphics, scripting, tests ...)

[redcoat2]

ECW ... it's unlikely that AGEOD would even consider making it. I would play the royalist side if it was.

I would play as the 'Cavaliers' as well. I'm sure that Prince Rupert would have the 'Cavalryman' special ability. Unfortunately Cromwell would probably have that ability as well ... along with others.

[Pocus]

@Kafka: It seems to me that HOI 2 is somehow at the right scale (although there is always room for improvements ). A monster game like WitP but for both european and pacific war would be unplayable really and if (when...) we are ready to do a WW2 game, I don't think we will trace all pilots names and achievements, or how many engine cells are needed to build a particular plane!

[kafka]

@pocus

ok you are not interested in such kind of games, maybe more a simulation than a game (provided you can define what a game is and what a simulation)

but on the other hand it's not true that such kinds of games are unplayable as the numerours witp (modding, too) community at the matrixforums proves

... and I did not mean a copy of witp for the european theatre and I did not mean a game which would cover the global conflict

... and as for complexity: It is not the job of a good game designer to manage complexity in a way that it turns to simplicity to the user through the UI?

but, anyway as you'are not interested ....

[miller41]

I wouldn't be to quick to assume that the English Civil war wouldn't sell here in the US. I for one was a huge fan of Avalon Hills boardgame Kingmaker and I know that the computer version would have done well if it had been done right. I would buy it for sure using this engine

[PhilThib]

But Kingmaker was dealing with the War of the Roses (1455-1487), not the English Civil War (1642-1651)

[Le Ricain]

But Kingmaker was dealing with the War of the Roses (1455-1487), not the English Civil War (1642-1651)

I think that Miller41 was referring to the fact that the War of the Roses is an even more obscure war than the English Civil War to Americans and apparently still did well.

[Carrington]

I'm particularly interested in ECW, and looking forward to getting GMT games' Unhappy King Charles and Here I Stand. It's an interesting period with too little attention given to it.

It has struck me that the engine might provide reasonable basis for a mod or scenario on Vietnam 65-75.

The general scale is about right... purists and treadheads would struggle with the idea that an age of enlightenment engine could handle our more brutal times. But actually I think the more difficult demands on the engine would be to accomodeat modeling of political will and commitment. The engine would have to be built upward, to accomodate strategic issues and resourcing, not, really, downward to deal with weapons systems.

[Pocus]

somehow planned, after a WW2 game. Air power, Aeromobile units and paradrops can't be done before the whole Air War is coded, so it need WW2 before. As for all things related to guerilla warfare, I would say we have already a strong base in BOA.

[Carrington]

somehow planned, after a WW2 game. Air power, Aeromobile units and paradrops can't be done before the whole Air War is coded, so it need WW2 before. As for all things related to guerilla warfare, I would say we have already a strong base in BOA.

You're probably right, Vietnam without audio and graphics for choppers and jets might be a hard sell, especially given the computer generation's still unsatiated taste for graphics and cool effects. But if the game were to have seasonal turns, area-based movement, and a strategic/operational focus, I don't think those units would be all that necessary.

Oops.. this might become a hijack... gonna take my response to a new thread.

ECW, or Wars of Religion... sounds great... How many have looked at the recent boardgames?

By the way, I've been looking for a forum or thread on AGEOD on Consimworld.com. Given the character of BOA, I'd suggest it highly, as well as, perhaps, cross-posting some shills in the 1776 and VG The Civil War threads.

[PhilThib]

By the way, I've been looking for a forum or thread on AGEOD on Consimworld.com. Given the character of BOA, I'd suggest it highly, as well as, perhaps, cross-posting some shills in the 1776 and VG The Civil War threads.

You are most welcome to do it on our behalf

[Dixicrat]

But Kingmaker was dealing with the War of the Roses (1455-1487), not the English Civil War (1642-1651)

I also enjoyed Kingmaker. I may be wrong, but I have the distinct impression that AH referred to the War of the Roses in their game literature as the "English Civil War". Until I read your post, I had believed that this was true. I don't think that I'm alone.

With that being said, I'd love to see either of the conflicts you've mentioned in a game by AGEOD.

Give me another year or so to develop my skills and knowledge, Phil, and I'll be more than happy to volunteer in whatever development capability you want me to do. But then again, maybe by that time AGEOD will be an international household word, and you'll be annoyed by all of the stacks and heaps of euros that you have to push through to reach your computer.

[Stwa]

This could be done indeed. We can get the historical sources easily, and adapt the engine. The problem is the graphics, which we have to rework and pay for. This is a budget of 10-12,000 euros we do not have right now... unless we find a fan who wish to partner with us and help us do that

Do a tactical level game of Gettsburg. (still on topic, its ECW 3).

This way you only have to pay for the map and regiment level data.

Maybe a few engine changes. Would sell more copies.

[Comtedemeighan]

I'd love to see you guys do a Philippine-American War game or a Spanish American war game

[berto]

I'd love to see you guys do a Philippine-American War game

Having lived in the Philippines for six years, so would I, but a game on that subject would sell, what, maybe a few hundred copies at best?

[Comtedemeighan]

Having lived in the Philippines for six years, so would I, but a game on that subject would sell, what, maybe a few hundred copies at best?

yeah probably but we can dream

[berto]

Hey, AGEod, here's a serious suggestion for you:

Based on the AGE engine, market a generic game developer's kit a la Norm Koger's The Operational Art of War.

Make it extremely modder friendly (since the whole point of the game/kit is to write mods for it), especially with good map, OOB, and event editors.

That way gamers with more rarified interests can indulge their gaming fantasies.

[PhilThib]

It is a huge project to develop...would take at least 1 year...we can't afford this on our small team, but the idea is good...we'll put more thoughts into it

[Carnium]

Based on the AGE engine, market a generic game developer's kit a la Norm Koger's The Operational Art of War.

That would be great. An engine developed by AGEOD and then "battle packs" developed by 3rd party creators and sold by AGEOD which would have more time to develop, improve and refine its game engine(s).

[berto]

This would not stop AGEod from developing high quality titles with great market appeal. It would just be a way that fans could develop games on more obscure topics, for example, the English Civil War, the War of Austrian Succession, the Great Northern War, the Thirty Years War, the Phillippine-American War--you name it.

[Halberdier]

I must to tell that Im a ocassional player that like read and talk about history, but Im not a core gamer.

Its a time to the letter a Santa? Ok here I go with my cristmas whish:

I buy your Napoleon campaigns game and it is beautifull but I need:

-to play it in my low cost NETBOOK (for example ASUS EEE or MSI wind).
-to play simple as your game about Amerian revolution, but your Napoleonic with Army corps and divisions etc is more difficult.
-simpliest and beauty 2D graphics as now, and less saturation information screen, and I need a Tactical 2D animation (window or screen) as genial solved by Panzer general I (and repeated by Panzer Tactics DS) please!!

and yes I agree IMO, and excuse me please Phil, your game is difficult to mod because we do not have friendly editors to do it.

OK. Now Im talk about my dream. You remember that I tell you a years ago about Hispanic American wars of independence. Here it is the only two wargames about Hispanic revolution that I know exist:

Liberators!
Liberators! is a wargamer's guide to the Wars of South American Independence.Each volume has a brief history of the fighting in the covered theatre, army organizations, complete uniformology and numerous ready to play scenarios. Much of the information in Liberators! is published in English for the first time.
"A clear summary of events, campaigns and uniforms" - Rene Chartrand
"A balanced, well researched, and exquisite guide to possibly the most obscure series of conflicts of the horse and musket era" - Brendan Morrissey

http://www.grenadierproductions.com/samples.htm
AUTOR: John Fletcher. Nationality:american. (IMO:great person who like to help in this periods)


War to death!
Warfare took place from the remote northern border with America to the tip of the continent now shared by Chile and Argentina. Progress ebbed and flowed, with territories changing hands several times and the intensity and size of battles slowly escalating.

The overall war is a fascinating struggle of varied elements, from Spanish and "Royalist" troops to formed patriot units, militias, armed mobs, Indians, and mercenaries. Actions include slave revolts, naval assaults, guerilla war, battles with a hostile environment, and the interplay of politics with economics...all depicted and intermeshed to affect overall play as they affected real events. The game offers a map from "New Spain" to "Rio de la Plata," with area movement, one-year turns, and 280 half-inch counters.

http://boardgamegeek.com/game/29447
AUTOR:Javier Romero. Nationality: Spaniard. (IMO: he recomend to me the best books about this period)


Phil, you can make history: Im sure that there are not any computer game about this period, and your engine is perfect to this period. In the next years there will be a celebration of bicentenary of independences. Here a resume of this war:

Cronology of Campaigns:

-1805 Battle of Trafalgar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Trafalgar
-1806 British invasion of Buenos aires and Montevideo.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_invasions_of_the_R%C3%ADo_de_la_Plata
-1809 Hispanoamerican revolution
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_American_Wars_of_Independence
-1811 war in Bolivia and Argentina.
-1815 war in Columbia and Venezuela
-1816 Brazil ocupation of Uruguay
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argentina-Brazil_War
-1818 War in Chile
-1820 War in Ecuator
-1824 War in Peru
-1829 Last Spain invasion of Mexico
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isidro_Barradas
-1835 Texas war
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_Revolution

Generals:

Spanish:
"Lt General" Pablo Morillo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pablo_Morillo
"Caudillo" Tomas Boves
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Tom%C3%A1s_Boves
"Viceroy" Juan Samano
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Jos%C3%A9_de_S%C3%A1mano_y_Uribarri
"King" Ferdinand VII
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferdinand_VII_of_Spain

Columbia:
"Libertador" Simon Bolivar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Bolivar
"General" Antonio Jose Sucre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonio_Jos%C3%A9_de_Sucre
"Caudillo" Manuel Piar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manuel_Piar
"Caudillo" Francisco Miranda
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francisco_de_Miranda



[EDIT]

Regards

PD sorry for the long post.

[PhilThib]

The problem is that there is no real market for this title, so we would not make up the time and money invested in the game.... but it could be easily done as a Mod by an enthusiastic volunteer such as you...

Our games look complex, but once you got the logic, this is not so difficult. One Spanish member in this forum has already started a very ambitious mod with Napoleon, and we give him support...this is feasible...ask him...

Contact is: aryaman