loki100 wrote:unfortunately its WAD. There is, but I can't find it back, a very good discussion of the stack combat mechanisms in RoP - the same applies in PoN. It can happen in a multiple stack fight that the enemy targets one of yours and not the others. I had it as a text file but seem to have lost it (had to back up my laptop and a lot got deleted).
The one critical time it happened to me was also in a war with the Ottomans when they concentrated on 1 out 3 stacks and pretty much destroyed it. However, their army's cohesion was shot and the other two were retreating but still in the province, so I reset their stances to all out attack and they took full revenge.
Its a part of the targetting algorithm, the same that within engaged stacks determines which brigades hit which opposing brigades. I find it happens a fair bit in RoP.
== '''Commitment of stacks''' ==
Stacks are sorted into 3 types depending on their posture: Aggressive/Offensive, Defensive, Passive. A stack in an aggressive/offensive posture in the region of battle is picked in a purely random manner and then will seek a target. It will choose first a non-moving enemy stack which is also in assault/attack stance and which is not already significantly threatened (meaning the enemy stack is attacked by a number of friendly line elements which is less than 150% of the number of line elements it has). If there is none, then a non threatened, moving stack will be picked.
If there is none, then the procedure will be repeated by seeking a non threatened defensive enemy stack (first non-moving, then moving). If there is none, then the procedure will be repeated by seeking a non threatened passive enemy stack (first non-moving, then moving). if there is none (meaning all enemy stacks are 'threatened'), then one at random will be picked.
This concept covers the first stack picked. What about the next? If the stack is already engaged by an enemy, it will fight back against him, and that's it. If this stack is in defensive/passive posture, it will also activate all other friendly stacks (of all friendly factions present) in the region (i.e if the combat is still involving only stacks outside the structure, then units in the structure will take no part).
If the stack was not yet involved but potentially could be (i.e Defensive stacks waiting for their release), then it will first help a threatened stack, if there is none, it will pick a target, as was done for the first stack that entered the battle.
Army HQs will never attack by themselves and always fight in support of another stack.
Correlatives: It is possible that a very small stack may target a large one, or the reverse. This is working as designed, and represents the randomness of battles, where a small force will face the brunt of an attack, or where it is on purpose delaying a large force while others troops attack the enemy elsewhere on the battlefield.
loki100 wrote:found it, its the text file in this post
but this is the key text:
key is that a stack in attack mode will pick a target, that target is then locked, if there any more stacks in attack mode they in turn will select targets - most times this will steadily draw in all the fresh stacks in a province (or marching to the sound of the guns) but sometimes one can fail, or a large stack pick on a small one etc, then you get the situation you have.
In the main, march to the sound of the guns works well in PoN (it should with telegraphic messaging etc) so my usual choice is to set up my stacks so they are more or less of a size. If its a big European war, I tend to use stacks of around 3000 pwr, this can cope with a couple of corps, some divisions, artillery and all the stuff you need to drag around. That way, if I get unlucky in the target mechanism, at least its not a small formation that is at risk of utter destruction that can be picked off.
Pocus wrote:I'm surprised you get so reliably this ganging problem. The code has not changed on that since several games, and ROP or AJE players don't suffer from it, so perhaps there are a specific set of conditions that makes it more probable in PON, but this seems odd.
The rules are:
a) if a defensive stack is attacked, ALL your defensive stacks will help him
b) if no defensive stack is attacked, and there is a fight with a stack of your in offensive, then confirmed, none of the defensive stacks will help (they are 'in reserve').
Now, if the enemy has several stacks, he will target without preference your defensive or offensive stacks, so chances are that he will end up not only targeting your offensive stack, but also one of your defensive stack, thus triggering the others defensive stacks of your.
But what you say the enemy always focus exclusively on your lone offensive stack. Or perhaps you had a straw of bad luck and you got that twice, but don't make it a rule.
The thing is, yes, there is a risk, to have stacks with different postures treated as being '2 layers'.
Last point, if everybody is in defensive but a single stack of your in offensive, then confirmed too, your stack will fight alone all the defensive stacks of your enemy, and he will receive no help from his buddies...
Pocus wrote:I can assure you that, unless the code is self mutating, the AI is not looking at your combat penalties, stack by stack. She can assess a stack power, and combat penalty lowers its power, so perhaps this is what you mean.
SonOfAGhost wrote:Uh, oh, he's anthropomorphizing the AI.
Pocus wrote:I'm surprised you get so reliably this ganging problem. The code has not changed on that since several games, and ROP or AJE players don't suffer from it, so perhaps there are a specific set of conditions that makes it more probable in PON, but this seems odd.
The rules are:
a) if a defensive stack is attacked, ALL your defensive stacks will help him
b) if no defensive stack is attacked, and there is a fight with a stack of your in offensive, then confirmed, none of the defensive stacks will help (they are 'in reserve').
Now, if the enemy has several stacks, he will target without preference your defensive or offensive stacks, so chances are that he will end up not only targeting your offensive stack, but also one of your defensive stack, thus triggering the others defensive stacks of your.
But what you say the enemy always focus exclusively on your lone offensive stack. Or perhaps you had a straw of bad luck and you got that twice, but don't make it a rule.
The thing is, yes, there is a risk, to have stacks with different postures treated as being '2 layers'.
Last point, if everybody is in defensive but a single stack of your in offensive, then confirmed too, your stack will fight alone all the defensive stacks of your enemy, and he will receive no help from his buddies...
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