generals fate after defeats

[Rafiki]

Trouble is, creating some kind of auto-promotion system will require large changes in the code, which I imagine Pocus et al don't have time for these days.

Though I'll be the first to agree that having something like it would be great

[Le Ricain]

The two best claims seem to be Powell and Johnson (10th Georgia). Burgess shot an officer on horseback who was leading an advance. (Several sources claim that Powell killed an officer on horseback as well). 4th Georgia was not on that part of the battlefield.

Comparing these two accounts convinced me it was Powell.

Confederate from Lee's Sharpshooters ... This is the book I mentioned earlier (about McGowan's Sharpshooters Battalion).

Union from The Cannoneer

The easy-to-find reference (note 2)

I'd like to find more information on Johnson. I know Fred Ray (his major proponent) is a meticulous researcher. Where did you find his name?

My source for 'Kansas Tom' Johnson.
http://history-sites.com/mb/cw/gacwmb/index.cgi?noframes;read=4078

Also in that thread is listed the full name of Sgt Grace (Charles D.).

[ironmajor]

Interesting sidebar...public statuary of civil war generals gives clues to their status at the end of the war. The statue of a general mounted on a horse
with all four legs on the ground survived the war, if the horse has one leg raised the said officer was wounded at some point during the war, if both forelegs are raised the rider was killed in action. Next time you see a statue of a civil war general remember this code and check the results it never fails.

Prime sites: Gettysburg
Philadelphia City Hall surrounded by Union generals
from Pennsylvania

[marecone]

Interesting sidebar...public statuary of civil war generals gives clues to their status at the end of the war. The statue of a general mounted on a horse
with all four legs on the ground survived the war, if the horse has one leg raised the said officer was wounded at some point during the war, if both forelegs are raised the rider was killed in action. Next time you see a statue of a civil war general remember this code and check the results it never fails.

Prime sites: Gettysburg
Philadelphia City Hall surrounded by Union generals
from Pennsylvania

Interesting .

[MarkCSA]

Interesting .

Urban Legend (not true), check snopes.com

[Skibear]

Urban Legend (not true), check snopes.com

Actually I am not sure snopes.com is right on this one (shock horror, something on the internet is wrong!!).

Example: She states that McPherson was killed in battle yet he has one hoof raised. But in fact I believe he was mortally wounded and died off the field of battle so the statue is correct.
Again, Casimir Pulaski. She says he died in battle but in fact he was wounded in battle and died two days later. The Statue is correct, snopes.com is wrong.

This system stated above is the accepted standard for military statues I believe, though whether or not all sculptors (or whatever statue makers are called) stick to that code is another matter. Never underestimate artistic licience. Her basic look around the Washington area does not mean that the accepted standard elsewhere is not true.

Sorry to shatter your faith in the internet. Santa Claus is real though, so is the Easter bunny.

[Jabberwock]

Wikipedia actually managed to get one right!

A common belief is that if the horse is rampant, that is with both front legs in the air, the rider died in battle. If the horse has one front leg up, the rider was wounded in battle or died of wounds sustained in battle, and if all four hooves are on the ground, the rider died of causes other than combat.

Although some statues in commemoration of the Battle of Gettysburg follow this practice, it is generally not used.

Does this mean a jolly guy in a wierd outfit, with no verifiable means of employment, and who gives his address as "the North Pole", will be invading my residence this winter? Hmmm, better load the shotgun just in case.

[Skibear]

No need for a shotgun, just put poison the mince pies.

I was thinking about some of the other statues snoops claims were wrong (its a slow day at work...).

She says Jacksons statue has all four hooves on the ground. This is open to interpretation as to whether the sculptor wanted to reflect he did not die from wounds from the enemy as such. I think this is artistic intrepretation.

Again Andrew Jackon with two hooves raised, i think is likely artistic intrepretation to make a dramatic statue ala Napoleons famous painting.

Anyway, back to work...

[Heldenkaiser]

I have always heard this one (with the horse legs) as common wisdom and to be sure, all equestrial statues that I have seen so far follow the custom. For instance, German Emperor Wilhelm I is often seen mounted, but the horse always has all four feet on the ground, as in spite of having led armies in battle he died peacefully in his bed at the ripe age of 91.

[MarkCSA]

Actually I am not sure snopes.com is right on this one (shock horror, something on the internet is wrong!!).

Example: She states that McPherson was killed in battle yet he has one hoof raised. But in fact I believe he was mortally wounded and died off the field of battle so the statue is correct.
Again, Casimir Pulaski. She says he died in battle but in fact he was wounded in battle and died two days later. The Statue is correct, snopes.com is wrong.

This system stated above is the accepted standard for military statues I believe, though whether or not all sculptors (or whatever statue makers are called) stick to that code is another matter. Never underestimate artistic licience. Her basic look around the Washington area does not mean that the accepted standard elsewhere is not true.

Sorry to shatter your faith in the internet. Santa Claus is real though, so is the Easter bunny.

Lies! The internet is always right!!!!! Why else would there be an internet???

[Le Ricain]

New question (probably too easy for Le Ricain):

Which two of the generals on his lists killed each other?

I do know the answer, but I am not sure if the question is for anyone but me to answer

[Jabberwock]

I do know the answer, but I am not sure if the question is for anyone but me to answer

Is anyone else searching for it? Give them another 24 hours. Then it is all yours.

[Jabberwock]

No need for a shotgun, just put poison the mince pies.

I need something all-purpose. The easter bunny nibbled off the edges of my pies, layed some chocolate eggs on the rest, and hopped away ... could we compromise on an aluminum ball-bat?

[Le Ricain]

New question (probably too easy for Le Ricain):

Which two of the generals on his lists killed each other?

The Battle of High Bridge:

On the 6th of April, 1865 a force of Confederate cavalry under the commands of MG's WHF Lee and T. Rosser moved to seize control of the High Bridge which spanned the Appomattox River.

A smaller Union force under the command of Bvt BG Theodore Read arrived at the bridge first and drove off the Confederate sentries.

When the CSA force arrived, Read led a cavalry charge which quickly dissolved into man-to-man combat. In the melee, Read exchanged pistol fire with Confederate BG James Dearing.

Read was killed and Dearing was mortally wounded. Dearing died on the 23rd of April making him the last general to be killed in the war.

[Jabberwock]

Good job LR. Your turn.

[pepe4158]

yeah I tried it as a strategy to get my crudier generals with high seniorty killed, by putting them in suicidal situations....a dismal failure as the reapeared usually somewhere ekse but their troops were all dead...go figure that 1 :-p

[GShock]

The point here is that any general could be killed, regardless of their rank. Battle cry of Freedom states clearly that general casualty was 15% higher than private casualty in comparison.

What the game does is to have your general killed or wounded only when the battle is a crushing defeat. At that point, when and only when the whole stack is obliterated, does the general wound/kill factor come into play.

It would be wonderful to have an operating army, regardless of victory/defeat, lose its general...besides how many generals were actually killed by disease or retired historically without the game taking it into account? See it doesn't specifically have to be related to combat.

The good side is that modding could help with that

[pepe4158]

Yeah but most common was killed in line of duty eka Reynolds,Jackson,Johnston...etc
So wish I could go get someone killed on purpose ...more realism

[Coregonas]

Well not an ACW theme but... related to your horse-generals affair... 240 years earlier...

1634 - Velazquez painted the Count-duke of Olivares mounted on a Horseback... with 2 frontal legs on the air.

The count duke had (in fact) almost all the power of the king. (Similar to Duke of Buckingham / Cardinal Richelieu)

I m not sure if certain 100% buthis was one of the first paintings with a "non-king" riding on a horse, reserved normally for them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equestrian_portrait_of_Duke_de_Olivares

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Favourite ---> here you can see another portrait (Buckingham) just face- not horse...

[GShock]

Even before Jackson...The very same Bee, who started the legend (and controversial interpretation of his exact meaning) of the "Stonewall" got killed immediately after that!

I guess the engine sees the unit as an entity and the general as a separate entity. Some sort of factoring should be taken into account (i agree to making the *** almost immune but not immune at all) so that when you are fighting all the generals in a astack have a chance to be wounded or killed. Freeing a ** or *** stars from the fray allows you to promote people in their place.

The loss of Stonewall Jackson was a TRUE turning point, one of the many...and especially for the way he died. It makes no sense right now to have the general killed only if the army is lost while it would make sense (like it historically happened) to have the general killed among the very same losses the army took. Stonewall's troopers never fought with the same proficiency again after his death, but they still survived his death. The exact opposite of how the wound/kill system works right now.

[Carnium]

Interesting discussion you have here
Is there a way to have a general or a commander of a defeated army captured when the whole stack is eliminated ? It is a bit strange to see almost all the leaders still alive and wandering alive when their armies are eliminated (seen this in my campaign after CSA was short on men and all these commanders wandered around like ghosts ).
These captured leaders could then be exchanged via the "exchange prisoners event" too.

[hootieleece]

I just finished my Union Campaign. I held every objective City listed but could only get stalemate. the Rebs out vp'd me 4536 to 4475. I beseiged and captured several confederate armies during the campaign. Only to have their generals raise new forces to annoy me. After September of 1864, I felt like I was in Vietnam. I held all the cities and if I didn't garrison them the rebs would sneak in an take it or rebel. Where did Athena get the wherewithal to keep raising troops.

I probably made some bad decisions early on that helped me lose....

[keith]

the generals abilities are i assume based on historical info, if the game was able to kill/capture generals then new random generals would have to be generated, promoted from the ranks so to speak, as the game is very much based around those abilities of tactics etc would the new theoretical generals all start with the same abilities or would there be a random chance of finding a new lee,grant or jackson.