Please advise is Suez or the Sinai sand sea are supposed to be allowing transit again or actually working.
The plantation on the Congo coast and interior mine still show up each turn as projected to produce by the engine, but nothing is collected. I also note that the trade window option to sell locally does not work - production shows projected on the trade window for Congo but greyed out. Also strange.
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Sir Garnet
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 8:23 pm
Early March 1875
Good to have you back, Vezina.
Good to have you back, Vezina.
Care to unify Germany as Austria? Recreate the Holy Roman Empire of the 20th Century:
Großdeutschland Mod
Are you tough enough to impersonate the Shogun and defy the Westerners? Prove it:
Shogun Defiance Mod (completed AAR)
Großdeutschland Mod
Are you tough enough to impersonate the Shogun and defy the Westerners? Prove it:
Shogun Defiance Mod (completed AAR)
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Sir Garnet
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 8:23 pm
Are Chinese superhuman?
I am stunned and extremely frustrated to have a full (!) army simply wiped out, again, by a weaker. It may be that I am doing completely stupid things but under my understanding of how battles should work, the below is simply unbelieveable.
A lost battle between equal forces - why? I could ask but it has no real relevance.
So, by superior forces, against a force having no guns at all, on defensive, benefiting from favourable ground, having caused more than double (!) hits my forces received - I lose a battle. Why? Under what standard? Not only I lose the battle but, again, suffer extreme casualties when retreating. So, in effect, a won battle has just turned to be a lost one.
This battle shoud have been a clear win on the actual numbers. Had the engine treated it as such, there would have been no Russian retreat, with hits numbering 100s again, and no wiped out force.
The finale: thanks to various retreats, my decimated force is simply wiped out again.
Unless the game operates under 'If China is involved, it must win' rule, I am completely in the dark as to (i) on what basis a defeat is determined; and (ii) why am I losing 100s of hits when retreating.
Brian, could you upload the !Battlelog.txt to the dropbox, please? Thx.
Edit: To make a full picture, here's a Russian win - something along the lines of my understanding of how the engine works.
After the 3rd hour, China only suffers 16 hit because of retreat. Russian forces suffered in the 100s, retreating after the 1 hour. Why?
If you check, Russian cavalry easily outnumbers the Chinese - shouln't they be hunting down stragglers?
A lost battle between equal forces - why? I could ask but it has no real relevance.
So, by superior forces, against a force having no guns at all, on defensive, benefiting from favourable ground, having caused more than double (!) hits my forces received - I lose a battle. Why? Under what standard? Not only I lose the battle but, again, suffer extreme casualties when retreating. So, in effect, a won battle has just turned to be a lost one.
This battle shoud have been a clear win on the actual numbers. Had the engine treated it as such, there would have been no Russian retreat, with hits numbering 100s again, and no wiped out force.
The finale: thanks to various retreats, my decimated force is simply wiped out again.
Unless the game operates under 'If China is involved, it must win' rule, I am completely in the dark as to (i) on what basis a defeat is determined; and (ii) why am I losing 100s of hits when retreating.
Brian, could you upload the !Battlelog.txt to the dropbox, please? Thx.
Edit: To make a full picture, here's a Russian win - something along the lines of my understanding of how the engine works.
After the 3rd hour, China only suffers 16 hit because of retreat. Russian forces suffered in the 100s, retreating after the 1 hour. Why?
If you check, Russian cavalry easily outnumbers the Chinese - shouln't they be hunting down stragglers?
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Soulstrider
- Major
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- Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:22 pm
- Location: Northern Lusitania
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lukasberger
- AGEod Veteran
- Posts: 782
- Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 5:59 pm
I would suggest you to zip all the turn saves, battlelogs and scripts and send everything to Pocus for analysis... Some things that could explain the defeat:
* the level of cohesion of the vanquished at the start of the battle...
* the Gansu battle is in the desert, so with a very low frontage...the less numerous Chinese are thus not handicapped by Russian superiority (who can't deploy all and thus be defeated in details)
* the bad weather in the last battle will reduce firing range, casualties and, more important, which facilitates retreat (much easier under heavy rainfal than inside a bright sunny desert)
Only logs can tell
* the level of cohesion of the vanquished at the start of the battle...
* the Gansu battle is in the desert, so with a very low frontage...the less numerous Chinese are thus not handicapped by Russian superiority (who can't deploy all and thus be defeated in details)
* the bad weather in the last battle will reduce firing range, casualties and, more important, which facilitates retreat (much easier under heavy rainfal than inside a bright sunny desert)
Only logs can tell
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lukasberger
- AGEod Veteran
- Posts: 782
- Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 5:59 pm
The Egyptians are professional army though. I don't think they should be. Some of the British observers in the Ottoman wars had some terrible things to say about the quality of Egyptian troops, essentially that they were nothing more than criminals and tramps given guns (and sometimes not even given guns!) and sent to fight. The only point where they should be possibly considered profession is when the Brits reformed them in the late 1890's and probably not even then.
Be that as it may, they are professional troops in game. So their quality is theoretically higher than that of the Germans.
Be that as it may, they are professional troops in game. So their quality is theoretically higher than that of the Germans.
Yes. Thoughts on the Russian/Chinese battles: China is fighting on home ground...? And what are the Morale numbers of each.... If Chinese were more....enough more, that has been the answer in some battles.... It does look inexplicably one sided.
When China was outnumbered by African troops with Britain in India.... the Africans lost heavily and it was due to Morale difference, I believe. The Russians had to Not be able to use their Cavalry and Cannon .....as suggested, low frontage.
China does lose Entire command units rather than just elements in several battles.......the Russians only lose Units in one of the battles.
Lebynsev is better Offensively and Chao Defensively........who attacks can make quite a difference as well.
China was lucky to get Liu Kunyi to fight at all. My experience: it was difficult to get him off the blocks. I understand him getting beat up.
Today: Gansu says Reg, Fair, Very Harsh Weather (can it be both?)...... If troops moved to the area to fight, that would hurt them quite a bit. And retreating could be bad news.
Ulaan Bator: Hills, Fair, Hide Bonus 1
When China was outnumbered by African troops with Britain in India.... the Africans lost heavily and it was due to Morale difference, I believe. The Russians had to Not be able to use their Cavalry and Cannon .....as suggested, low frontage.
China does lose Entire command units rather than just elements in several battles.......the Russians only lose Units in one of the battles.
Lebynsev is better Offensively and Chao Defensively........who attacks can make quite a difference as well.
China was lucky to get Liu Kunyi to fight at all. My experience: it was difficult to get him off the blocks. I understand him getting beat up.
Today: Gansu says Reg, Fair, Very Harsh Weather (can it be both?)...... If troops moved to the area to fight, that would hurt them quite a bit. And retreating could be bad news.
Ulaan Bator: Hills, Fair, Hide Bonus 1
For those who are interested, there is no craftsmen production of Electrical. My factory has come on line, and I have some in inventory, but no craftsmen production.
Nemethand, on checking the logs,
In the 1st battle (on day 6), only a small portion of your army engaged (it appears 1 unit fought the Chinese) you engaged at range 2, but his cavalry charged you and forced your troops to route repeatedly (until destroyed). The entire rest of your army didn't engage.
During the 2nd battle (day 7), you took 27% hits for your force (which was over the 25% threshold, which forced an auto retreat). It appears that his entire force that fought was cavalry units.
PS - it appears that the number of men per hit is extremely low for the Chinese (so even though he takes a lot of hits, he has a lot of hits, and only a few *men* are killed)
Nemethand, on checking the logs,
In the 1st battle (on day 6), only a small portion of your army engaged (it appears 1 unit fought the Chinese) you engaged at range 2, but his cavalry charged you and forced your troops to route repeatedly (until destroyed). The entire rest of your army didn't engage.
During the 2nd battle (day 7), you took 27% hits for your force (which was over the 25% threshold, which forced an auto retreat). It appears that his entire force that fought was cavalry units.
PS - it appears that the number of men per hit is extremely low for the Chinese (so even though he takes a lot of hits, he has a lot of hits, and only a few *men* are killed)
Remember - The beatings will continue until morale improves.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Sir Garnet
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 8:23 pm
Jim-NC wrote:PS - it appears that the number of men per hit is extremely low for the Chinese (so even though he takes a lot of hits, he has a lot of hits, and only a few *men* are killed)
Yes, there was some explanation for Western hits being more men than Chinese and others, but I don't recall what it was and don't know the combat mechanics take account of this. PhilThib, do you know?
PS - Brazil will be selling Electricals for export once the factory is finished. Combining them with Gems provides marvelous chandeliers.
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Sir Garnet
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 8:23 pm
When expected elements do not engage, the most usual culprit (all other things equal) is cohesion of the elements in question. That and some bad rolls in dice, obviously.
Care to unify Germany as Austria? Recreate the Holy Roman Empire of the 20th Century:
Großdeutschland Mod
Are you tough enough to impersonate the Shogun and defy the Westerners? Prove it:
Shogun Defiance Mod (completed AAR)
Großdeutschland Mod
Are you tough enough to impersonate the Shogun and defy the Westerners? Prove it:
Shogun Defiance Mod (completed AAR)
Kensai, any idea why this script isn't working...
It did not work the second time either.
Code: Select all
SelectFaction = $GER
SelectRegion = $Brandenburg
StartEvent = Transfer of Ownership of Saarland (Did not work first time)|1|1|NULL|NULL|$Berlin|NULL
Actions
SelectFaction = $GER
SelectRegion = $Saarland
ChangeRgnOwner = RUS
EndEventIt did not work the second time either.
Two potential errors :
* the |[color="#B22222"]$Berlin[/color]| in the start event line is wrong, as this region does not exist, the event is just ignored...put [color="#B22222"]$Brandenburg[/color] (which is the exact alias of Berlin region) and it should work
* The purpose is to return Saarland to Germany, from the Russians, right? ...because it is what the event will do when it works (not the other way round, and won't work if Saarland is not controlled by the Russians)
* the |[color="#B22222"]$Berlin[/color]| in the start event line is wrong, as this region does not exist, the event is just ignored...put [color="#B22222"]$Brandenburg[/color] (which is the exact alias of Berlin region) and it should work
* The purpose is to return Saarland to Germany, from the Russians, right? ...because it is what the event will do when it works (not the other way round, and won't work if Saarland is not controlled by the Russians)
PhilThib wrote:Two potential errors :
* the |[color="#B22222"]$Berlin[/color]| in the start event line is wrong, as this region does not exist, the event is just ignored...put [color="#B22222"]$Brandenburg[/color] (which is the exact alias of Berlin region) and it should work
* The purpose is to return Saarland to Germany, from the Russians, right? ...because it is what the event will do when it works (not the other way round, and won't work if Saarland is not controlled by the Russians)
Thank you for the corrections. The purpose is to return the structures in Saarland back to Germany from Russia. These do not get returned when an ally retakes a province. For some reason only MC, the city and military structures are handed over, but not the economic structures.
lukasberger wrote:The Egyptians are professional army though. I don't think they should be. Some of the British observers in the Ottoman wars had some terrible things to say about the quality of Egyptian troops, essentially that they were nothing more than criminals and tramps given guns (and sometimes not even given guns!) and sent to fight. The only point where they should be possibly considered profession is when the Brits reformed them in the late 1890's and probably not even then.
Be that as it may, they are professional troops in game. So their quality is theoretically higher than that of the Germans.
The army is indeed professional technically (game-wise). I think this is accurate if they are trained by a Western army and do NOT have conscription laws, meaning a national draft army. Yes, their leaders and units will get some free extra experience, but I believe the models of Egyptian elements are fairly outdated, so in the end if you are a Western army you can outgun them. Since Egypt also trails in R&D it also means it does not have various other bonuses the more advanced Germans have. Remember: battle results depend on a combination of unit quantity, quality, cohesion, terrain, weather and dice rolls (luck).
Luck is always important. This might be much more obvious in a naval battle where a catastrophic hit by a shell can provide for a 400% damage. Imagine an ammo store exploding! There you go: a crafty little torpedo boat just sank your dreadnought!
Care to unify Germany as Austria? Recreate the Holy Roman Empire of the 20th Century:
Großdeutschland Mod
Are you tough enough to impersonate the Shogun and defy the Westerners? Prove it:
Shogun Defiance Mod (completed AAR)
Großdeutschland Mod
Are you tough enough to impersonate the Shogun and defy the Westerners? Prove it:
Shogun Defiance Mod (completed AAR)
bjfagan wrote:Thank you for the corrections. The purpose is to return the structures in Saarland back to Germany from Russia. These do not get returned when an ally retakes a province. For some reason only MC, the city and military structures are handed over, but not the economic structures.
OK, try if this works.. if not, the trick will be different: we do a script where you "kill" all structures in the region and you recreate them with the rightful owner...that's what I have done in another ongoing game to transfer structures ownership without altering anything else...
Example ----
SelectFaction = $CMN
SelectRegion = $Lorraine
SelectFaction = $CMN
SelectRegion = $Lorraine
StartEvent = evt_nam_FRA_Coalmine_Purchase_From_German_Private_Owners_1880|1|1|NULL|NULL|$Lorraine|NULL
Conditions
MinDate = 1880/01/01
MaxDate = 1899/12/31
Actions
SelectFaction = $GER
SelectRegion = $Lorraine
RemoveStructure = ByDefUID $Coal2;ALL;GER
CreateStruc
SetType = $COAL2
SetName = Petite Rosselle Minen
Apply
SelectFaction = $FRA
SelectRegion = $Lorraine
CreateStruc
SetType = $COAL2
SetName = Charbonages de Gandrange
Apply
EndEvent
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