Where is Jeb???

[Lee]

Hi guys! I have another problem: shortly - where dissappeared Jeb Stuart's division? I ordered to take Syracuse (see the picture). Division was partially unsupplied (50%) and has 5 units inside. At beginning of the new turn, I can read: "J.E.B Stuart's Command has arrived in Oneida...", but there is no Stuart , only J.Mounton command left (he was in stack with Stuart's Div.). I have not Stuart in a Roster as well...

[soloswolf]

Firstly, J.E.B.'s a long way from home!

He may have been hurt by weather? Did you have supply wagons with you? Was any other element hurt by weather? Was he in the div., or was Mounton in the div. and J.E.B. was just in the stack?

There was no fight?


Just go through your message log and see if it reveals anything.

[Lee]

It was Division made of 4 brigades. I jumped from town to town, so the division was always supplied. Mounton was on top of that. None of the elements was hurt by the weather. There was no fight beause enemy units evaded which was described in message log.

[soloswolf]

Is Stuart in any of your cities? I know you said he is not on your roster, but maybe he was wounded and is recovering somewhere?

I am surprised that there is no message giving you any indication.

[Lee]

Unfortunately, there is no general Stuart on the map. I checked every city from Virginia to Texas. For me very strange.

[GShock]

If he was present on map, the ER buttons with Sentry command would let you find him. You'd still see his tab, even if he was wounded, and, in any case, he should be on the roster page.

I'd go back one turn, 2 turns, 3 turns if needed to find him again and see what's become of him. Could be a bug or...could be a missed report, yet sometimes some infos are missing from the log, better be sure as it could be a bug.

[Brochgale]

If he was present on map, the ER buttons with Sentry command would let you find him. You'd still see his tab, even if he was wounded, and, in any case, he should be on the roster page.

I'd go back one turn, 2 turns, 3 turns if needed to find him again and see what's become of him. Could be a bug or...could be a missed report, yet sometimes some infos are missing from the log, better be sure as it could be a bug.

I have experienced missing entries from logs especially when moving Generals but have not yet had a General go missing on me - always knew who I was moving where.
Most notably when I get a clutch of CSA Generals entering war in Jan62.

[W.Barksdale]

He died from the cold and lack of supplies. Looks like he took his division with him since you aren't in control of the city.

[Lee]

The funniest thing for me - general Mounton is still in region Oneida (about 6 months) - he is full supplied but quite alone, so I have a spy

He died from the cold and lack of supplies. Looks like he took his division with him since you aren't in control of the city.

I thought like that, but - Division was 50% supplied and 6 days from Syracuse. There was no message about bad weather - and as I told the only message was: ""J.E.B Stuart's Command has arrived in Oneida...""

[W.Barksdale]

The other general is there because lone leaders can survive almost anything. Moving through cold and snow will wreck a division in no time. Ill bet by the time they got there all their cohesion was gone and had no strength to do anything but lay down and die. Looks to me like what happened anyway...

[GShock]

Of the missing informations in log, one of those i miss the most is about generals being promoted. I happened sometimes to see a ** coming from a * general i hadn't promoted. That is a good news at least because it allows the creation of a new corps...

[pepe4158]

Ya I duno tho; Im beginning to think the only way to play this game is a leader MUST be activated to move.
I dunno im a purist when it comes to history and gaming, games like a WWII risk game, where the Japaneese can invade mainland USA I usually throw in a dumbster, n its almost as absurd to see a rebel Cav brigade running around upstate NY...get a grip this is an utter pipe-dream (in Davis's best dreams),logistically it just couldnt happen, but I understand the mechanics allow for it so every one uses this exploit early.
Thank god these people had the forsight to program so many variables and starting game conditions of play to keep us all happy tho.

[Gray_Lensman]

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[GShock]

Perhaps there was a mistake and Jeb was sent to Alaska instead of Mc Clellan

[pepe4158]

What I am getting at is if your playing with the leader activation rule ON, the south player may want to think twice about wanting to waste a division status leader to use that tactic that I would dare say is a non-historical exploit anyway.
That is the tie in to the thread, I mean the player is complaining he COULDNT maintain Stuart, in upstate NY, well from a historical point of view NO-DUH is what I am getting at.
1. In PvP have i used that cheesy trick-yes
2. Do I think its utter historic BS-yes

What I am getting at, if one plays activtated leaders units can only move, seems way more historically accurate, but I quess diminishes the, 'fun' value, so I am kind of tore there. I need to then get a better understanding of this leader activation process, as too many leaders stay inactive too long historically for my taste, n wish I understood the mechanism behind that better.

So what I am getting at, not to sound mean, is I am glad Stuart died in your game as it is tottaly bogus historically that he could even get that far and as far as I am concerned, concerning PvP that exploit really needs to be addressed...does the south really need to do that to win, or they do it just because in the game they can?...I assure you in RL it would have been impossible....n the game makes Shermans march to the sea almost impossible...but that DID happen which throws things way outta wack IMO

[Brochgale]

Where is Jeb?

I think R.E.Lee was asking this same question right before Gettysburg!

What a game! It even accurately simulates the occasional larks of JEB Stuart.

He could always look on the map to see if he has captured a lot of yankee wagons - not that they would do JEB any good though?

[Gray_Lensman]

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[pepe4158]

Excuse me...but running a confederate force, across upstate NY...of deep raiding cavalry ISNT even close to what historicaly happened (or could happen) and No-way-Jose youl get me to buy that 1!

I think im correct in saying the deepest raid ever was Hanover Pa...not even close to upstate NY or the Great Lakes MI area as the game mechanism allows.

Hmm not to be offensive, but Im gona take a wild quess n say you live in Europe?

[Gray_Lensman]

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[pepe4158]

And No, I don't live in Europe, I live in Missouri.

edit> btw, whether or not you agree with me on this issue, it might be rather insulting to a lot of other forum readers to insinuate that just because they live in Europe, they don't know as much about the Civil War as you. I would refrain from those types of comments.

But let me take a wild quess n say they havent driven across that terrain a million times (upstate NY or Michigan) as I have (if they live in Europe) Most Europeans havent seen the terrain with their own eyes, I have, is what I was getting at. I couldnt begin to tell them about terrain for CoN; I havent been over there, only read about it and its the same difference if they tried to tell me about a cavalry ride Napolean made from Orleans to wherever. I would be clueless without actually seeing the terrain with my own eyes versus he could go out his door and look at it.

Do you think a cavalry ride from Joplin Mo to St Louis would be practical!!!! thats the territory you live in so Im trying to bring it close to home to you.

Ive driven that stretch a million times too along I-44 ...and I recall its appx 270 miles....good grief you think you could do that in ACW times in a week? as the terrain is similar there to upstate NY....its half the distance you mentioned...go to any history proffessor, you will see what the game allows borders on lunacy....like I said do I do it to when playing the game as the game mechanism allows it, do I think at some point it needs to be addressed at some time (yes, but imagine you guys have a full agenda).....tell you what, if you still think its correct I will contact a history Professor and maybe you will believe him?

I dunno maybe the ride is in some cases is possible, but I sure wouldnt feel like tearing up RR tracks or taking charge of a whole town, more like a good night sleep in a bed for a week after that ride.

Hee-hee o BTW ...you do great maps,nice n colorfull n i love em

[Skibear]

Each turn is 2 weeks so 270miles would be 18 miles per day. Not too fantastic on horseback. But while it is possible in the game to get to upstate New York, then supply wise its difficult and quite rightly there is every chance that it is a one way mission which is as it should be.

And I agree with Grey. I am from UK/Europe but have travelled extensively through 26 of the US states over the years, including many of the battlefields and like to read widely on this subject. Where somebody is based does not preclude them from having a clue. You might have driven that interstate, but I'm guessing it wasnt there in the 1860s?

BTW Shelby Foote book is great. I found the 2nd volume it in a little second hand shop in New Orleans 11 years ago and carried it round the world with me. Just been rereading it this week. I wish I could find the first volume. But yes, great account of Morgan's raid and definately demonstrates the potential for long distance raiding, but as they were finally boxed in by union cavalry, militia and gunboats and captured it nicely displays (once again!) that this is a greatly modelled game.

[pepe4158]

Each turn is 2 weeks so 270miles would be 18 miles per day. Not too fantastic on horseback. But while it is possible in the game to get to upstate New York, then supply wise its difficult and quite rightly there is every chance that it is a one way mission which is as it should be.

Where somebody is based does not preclude them from having a clue. You might have driven that interstate, but I'm guessing it wasnt there in the 1860s?
.

No but I doubt they have changed the moutains, rivers, streams, gullies, n valleys one must wade through to traverse this terrain by horse Ski since 1860
The 270 mile mark Ski, was St louis to Joplin Mo...its more from say Alexandria Va--to Upstate Ny.
The relevance Ski is the terrain...Id much rather ride a horse fro St Louis to Chicago...then Joplin to St Louis ...n close to the same distance...liitle less i recall stlouie-Chicago
Oh well...tell you what, would you belive it if I find a history professor to refute that could be done?....I quess Ill have to start bugging one to settle this lol

[Gray_Lensman]

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[Skibear]

I read and understood that you were talking about 1-44 in missouri. But if you think you cant do 270 miles in the two week game period as a light horse raider then a history professor will prove you wrong I think. Even 36 miles a day to do it in a week is possible, though more difficult obviously. I spent alot of time in deepest darkest outback Queensland, Australia on horseback. Not as mountainous, but plenty of rough and hilly woodland and creeks and 36 miles is entirely possible. Sometimes you might go 1 mile an hour, sometimes you might go 5-8 miles an hour but if you are a hard riding raider going 12+ hours a day then you'd be suprised at how the milage can add up I think.

[GShock]

Pepe, saying "You leave in Europe" to the AACW coordinator and cartographer was the biggest stupidity i ever heard second only to "i saw my grandma flying a donkey".

[pepe4158]

youl kill your horse ski ...n i was only quessing Shock...i didnt say I knew, it just sounds like someone who doesnt know the terrain would think.

The relevance to Europe is I couldnt begin to tell a European what a horse ride would be like in his own country.

[Gray_Lensman]

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[pepe4158]

He-he least we know what happened to Stuart....skibear rode his horse to death!

[Gray_Lensman]

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[Rafiki]

We don't really want to see the thread degenerate into a flame war.

[color="Red"]Indeed. Let facts and explanations make your points and leave the snide remarks and characterizations about those you are discussing with by the door on your way in.

Thank you for your attention.[/color]