---> AACW Patch 1.10b release

[runyan99]

You should be seeing less attrition in an area with a city.

By the way, trying to keep units at full strength is probably the most inefficent use of manpower with the attrition option on. This is because the size of a unit is taken into account. A fresh full strength regiment will quickly lose a number of sickly, soft or half-hearted recruits. After some time the core of the regiment will remain, and these men will tend not to desert or get sick. They are the hardcore veterans.

As a regiment gets smaller in the game, it will lose less an less attrition. For example, a 10 hit regiment will suffer half as much attrition loss as a 20 hit regiment, all things being equal. So, striving for full sized regiments at all times will lead to very ineffiecient use of manpower. If you let your regiments attrit down to 500-700 men, you will use less replacements. And, the army sizes will also be much closer to historical numbers.

With the attrition option off, you can keep full strength units. With it on, you should not really strive for this, and intead use 'boosts' of replacements occasionally to keep decent sized regiments.

[berto]

By the way, trying to keep units at full strength is probably the most inefficent use of manpower with the attrition option on. This is because the size of a unit is taken into account. A fresh full strength regiment will quickly lose a number of sickly, soft or half-hearted recruits. After some time the core of the regiment will remain, and these men will tend not to desert or get sick. They are the hardcore veterans.

As a regiment gets smaller in the game, it will lose less an less attrition. For example, a 10 hit regiment will suffer half as much attrition loss as a 20 hit regiment, all things being equal. So, striving for full sized regiments at all times will lead to very ineffiecient use of manpower. If you let your regiments attrit down to 500-700 men, you will use less replacements. And, the army sizes will also be much closer to historical numbers.

Good analysis, spot on, in keeping with historical facts.

That the game (also before, pre-patch?) models these historical conditions is simply amazing.

The grognards are getting happier and happier...

[soloswolf]

After some time the core of the regiment will remain, and these men will tend not to desert or get sick. They are the hardcore veterans.

Is this flavor, or something that is actually taken into account? If it is actually taken into account, that is super-cool.

For example, a 10 hit regiment will suffer half as much attrition loss as a 20 hit regiment, all things being equal.

Do you take half as much because you are half the size? Or do you take a smaller percentage overall?

[Rafiki]

For example, a 10 hit regiment will suffer half as much attrition loss as a 20 hit regiment, all things being equal.

However, if you use your manpower to build new units, you will have more units to take losses from, so overall, there should be little difference? I.e. two 10-hit regiments will combined loose the same amount of men as one 20-hit regiment?

[runyan99]

Do you take half as much because you are half the size? Or do you take a smaller percentage overall?

The number of hits in the unit is part of the calculation. So, the smaller the unit, the less attrition.

[soloswolf]

For example, a 10 hit regiment will suffer half as much attrition loss as a 20 hit regiment, all things being equal.

But that is the same percentage of losses. I just want to make sure I am not missing anything in your posts.

[runyan99]

I.e. two 10-hit regiments will combined loose the same amount of men as one 20-hit regiment?

On average yes. So I guess the question is, what would you rather have on the map, one unit or two? Probably best to have two units, to cover the map better, either on offense or defense.

[runyan99]

But that is the same percentage of losses. I just want to make sure I am not missing anything in your posts.

The way the math currently works, basically a 20 hit regiment has a 33% chance of taking a hit, while a 10 hit regiment has a 16.5% chance of taking a hit.

[Franciscus]

(...)
- added: Divisions can now replace whole lost elements.

I would like a small clarification of this. In my current game I formed a division under Polk, with just 16 elements. In the last turn, the division got a new element - a cavalry regiment, making it now 5 cav regiments... . Breaking the division apart, I can see that it was the II/2nd Bde, that received the extra cavalry, as I think happened usually before 1.10 if it was kept as a separate unit (not inside a division).
So, how does the new rule really works:
- understrength elements inside a division can get replacements and lost elements, due to battle, etc, can be replaced (seems obvious)
- Brigades that start the game with empty "slots" (as several of them do) continue to receive new elements (if replacements are available) when inside a division, although the type is not exactly controlable by the player ( leure: ).
- But "understrength" divisions (ie, with less than 18 elements) with no understrength brigades inside will not (?) automatically receive new elements if available until the 18 cap is reached (at least I hope so, but now I do not know)

What have you seen in your games ?. How does this work, exactly ?

[soloswolf]

The type of element you get is determined by the type of brigade it is. It will always be the same construction for that bde.

You can usually find out what you will get with...
a) experience
b) checking it's state of origin and what it has/how many of each type of bde from that state are on the map.

I have never seen a div get broken up by this new process.

Your wounded units will still receive replacements. I would imagine also that the 18 element limit would hold true. So just make sure to remove those bde's needing more elements from that div if you are at your cap and in a position to re-fit them.

You were never able to decide what units were added. There are a few combos one can do, but that's it.

[Franciscus]

Thanks, soloswolf, I think that everything you say is spot on.
Nevertheless this might get a little confusing for new players, but I think it is a major improvement in the game.

My sole question, really, is this:
- Will a division intentionally built by a player with "full" brigades but with less than the maximum cap of elements receive automatically new elements until this cap is reached ? I think not, because the mechanics are fundamentally not changed, I think - ie, new elements go to brigades. But I would like to see this absolutely clarified...

[soloswolf]

You are saying:

"I have a 12 element division made up of (4) 3 element bdes. Will I get more elements added to this to bring it up to 18?"

If that's your question, the awnser is no.

[Brochgale]

It seems that the only way you can stop a division getting an element you dont want is to fill all 18 element slots.
I have had divisions receive elements I did not want and unbalance the division from my point of view. The replacement "new" elements I have been getting are mostly cavalry.
It is late nov 1861 in my latest game and it is the case that my divisions in comabat have been bleeding Infantry and Artillery and not Cavalry yet the fresh replacements or reinforcement as they are called in log are nearly all Cavalry.
I had one division 16 element division made up of what I thought were 2 full brigades and loose elements of cavalry,sharps and artillery. I got 2 cavalry elements I did not want or expect.

[Pocus]

Are you sure? This should be like Soloswolf says... If you are really sure, we can look at your save.

About regiments losing men as time passes. The losses are indeed proportional to number of men (I would favor a tweak so that the core/vets/cadre take less), but its efficiency in battle, even if slightly weakened by the loss of men, is not directly proportional: If a regiment has lost 50% of its men, it loses perhaps only 25% of its firepower, so we have indeed a veteran effect here.

[richfed]

I have another game started as the CSA ... exactly the same settings, except I took away the AI's FOW advantage. I am know managing a little better. AI is awesome. Nice job, Pocus! Organization of forces is now more important than ever!

Still, though, I am not experiencing way out of proportion attrition [historical setting]. Seems to be working ok.

[Inside686]

AI is definitely better but it still makes armies with 35% penalty

[W.Barksdale]

Anyone else notice that not all reinforcements are on the New Units Raised screen when alot are ordered?

[soloswolf]

I have seen this happen, but it has always been a question of a tight resource situation that gets a bit skewed by inflation.

[W.Barksdale]

Perhaps I should make myself more clear. They are still appearing on map, however, not appearing on New Units Raised screen.

[soloswolf]

Gotcha. I have not seen that.

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[W.Barksdale]

This may be a silly question, but have you tried to scroll the screen?

Indeed.

If no one else has noticed this I'll try to reproduce it and post the appropriate saves.

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[W.Barksdale]

Okay here we are. Load up the Federals. 130 units purchased in backup1. No inflation with resources to spare. New Units raised screen states only 74.
Can't believe no one else has noticed this. Maybe it's just my install?

[Jabberwock]

It happened to me in the Grand Campaign. On turn two I ordered 139 new units. Only 52 made it to that announcement & screen. I was looking all over for missing units. Apparently there was only one missing, which I figured was due to the fact that I got 8 less conscription points than the options had originally stated.

[soloswolf]

Can you put up some screen shots to show us the units you purchased? Maybe if we know what cities they are in, we can help figure out the issue.

[bigus]

Anyone else notice that not all reinforcements are on the New Units Raised screen when alot are ordered?

Confirmed. I just ordered 75 units and only 24 showed in the New Units raised screen.

bigus

[Brochgale]

It seems to be a problem with the Federals. I have just raised 44 units in my latest game as CSA and everything is as it should be so far. I counted them all to make sure.
So far so good at least.

[Pocus]

We'll check that, thanks.

[mp84]

Hey,

Need a quick clarification on the historical attrition option.

The tool-tip states that with it on, you'll only recieve replacements with a depot on it. Now, in order to receive those replacements, do my units need to be inside the city/depot? or can it still receive replacements outside the depot/city, but naturally in the same region..?

thanks,

MP