I was trying to move a mess of muddled units from Fort Pickens (failed siege) and noticed some movement anomalies. The base data follows at the end of the post; all movement described is from Ft. Pickens to Santa Rosa FL in mud.
Oddities:
- Jubal Early who is supposed to be a Fast Mover in all cases moves much slower than the other leaders whether in command of a stack or a Division.
- Josh McCown OTOH moves incredibly fast, again whether in command of a Div or a stack.
- Movement penalties/rates for some units when moving independently seem to disappear when they are imbedded in a division.
- There are apparently some weird cumulative penalties (albeit slight) when you combine units with the same movement speed; ie an infantry unit and an artillery unit who would make a move in a certain amount of time do not achieve the same speed when combined. Don't see a problem here I just did not realize it was happening.
I guess bottom line is that after spending almost an hour mixing and matching I still could not resolve exactly what was happening and why. The Early/McCown portion of things alone led me to believe something may be a little off.
Sample of test results:
Movement rates form Ft. Pickens to Santa Rosa FL (marsh, mud):
Division under J McCown which includes infantry, artillery and cavalry: 2 days
Same Division under Jubal Early (Fast Mover): 4 days
Same Division under McCown + Engineer: 3 days
Same Division under Early + Engineer: 16 days (? – what happened here)
Cavalry unit moving alone: 6 days
Sharpshooter unit moving alone: 8 days
Engineer unit moving alone: 11 days
Signal unit moving alone: 11 days
Infantry unit moving alone: 12 days
Artillery unit moving alone: 12 days
Infantry + Artillery unit together (same units as above): 13 days
Sharpshooter + cavalry + artillery: 13 days
Sharpshooter + cavalry + artillery + infantry: 15 days
Early + Sharpshooter + cavalry + artillery + infantry: 17 days (?)
McCown + Sharpshooter + cavalry + artillery + infantry: 7 days (?)
(Edit: Early and McCown were both activated, so no penalties because of that; check your email for savegame info Pocus.)
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Jabberwock
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mikee64
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OK, the CP affect can account for some of the discrepancies; thanks Wilhammer and Jabberwock. (And that's actually another pretty cool thing.)
However something still seems amiss (in addition to the Early/McCown oddity).
I can move a 12 lb artillery unit alone to an adjacent region in 41 days; this unit has a 5% CP penalty. But if I move an infantry brigade with an embedded 12 lb artillery unit along the exact same route, and with a 10% CP penalty, it only takes 35 days.
Maybe I'm looking for some linearity or other obvious structure to movement times that is just too complicated to spot, but the combinations I can produce just in this one instance seem weird.
However something still seems amiss (in addition to the Early/McCown oddity).
I can move a 12 lb artillery unit alone to an adjacent region in 41 days; this unit has a 5% CP penalty. But if I move an infantry brigade with an embedded 12 lb artillery unit along the exact same route, and with a 10% CP penalty, it only takes 35 days.
Maybe I'm looking for some linearity or other obvious structure to movement times that is just too complicated to spot, but the combinations I can produce just in this one instance seem weird.
don't forget that leaderless units always get maximum CP penalty for movement. In this case (leaderless units) the CP listed is for combat only.
For leaders, the CP penalty listed is for movement and combat, except if the leader is not activated, in this case you revert to case (1): he get max CP penalty (-35% speed) for movement only.
A unit move at the speed of the first line element in the unit, this is why a division with regiment + battery will move faster than a lone battery. This is a simplification to speed up the pathfinding, but you can always think of some real reason, like the regiments leasing men and mules to the artillery.
Mike I got your save, but knowing these additional infos, perhaps your questionning is solved? If not, tell me specifically what is the movement that poses you a problem, I will check it.
For leaders, the CP penalty listed is for movement and combat, except if the leader is not activated, in this case you revert to case (1): he get max CP penalty (-35% speed) for movement only.
A unit move at the speed of the first line element in the unit, this is why a division with regiment + battery will move faster than a lone battery. This is a simplification to speed up the pathfinding, but you can always think of some real reason, like the regiments leasing men and mules to the artillery.
Mike I got your save, but knowing these additional infos, perhaps your questionning is solved? If not, tell me specifically what is the movement that poses you a problem, I will check it.
Hofstadter's Law: "It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's law."
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mikee64
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This is my fault as I did not get Pocus the correct save, so I told him I would do some more testing to maybe make any problems easier to find.
I set up the 1864 scenario and tested different movement rates; the explanation above cleared up most issues with independent units.
However, I do think there is a problem with Jubal Early and movement. In all cases, whether leading a division or not, and with the same troops in all cases, he moves slower than other "normal" leaders. It is almost as if he has the slow mover trait by mistake instead of fast mover in the DB.
I have test saves set up with several different locations and scenarios, but the easiest thing to check might be Early's movement trait. If anyone wants to confirm this just set up the 1864 scenario and turn the AI off; you should see that whenever Jube is included there is a penalty.
I set up the 1864 scenario and tested different movement rates; the explanation above cleared up most issues with independent units.
However, I do think there is a problem with Jubal Early and movement. In all cases, whether leading a division or not, and with the same troops in all cases, he moves slower than other "normal" leaders. It is almost as if he has the slow mover trait by mistake instead of fast mover in the DB.
I have test saves set up with several different locations and scenarios, but the easiest thing to check might be Early's movement trait. If anyone wants to confirm this just set up the 1864 scenario and turn the AI off; you should see that whenever Jube is included there is a penalty.
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