EU3: Napoleon's Ambition

[Primasprit]

The GamersGate-Newsletter informed me that it is out now. So has anyone tried it already?

[Sol Invictus]

I thought it was still a few weeks until release. I will wait until I see some feedback until I decide whether to get it. I have plenty of games to keep me busy at the moment and Napoleon's Campaigns will be much better imo.

[Pocus]

We won't focus on the same things and not at the same level too. You won't be able to convince Russia to send troops to the Peninsula War in NCP for example.

[Primasprit]

I thought it was still a few weeks until release. I will wait until I see some feedback until I decide whether to get it. I have plenty of games to keep me busy at the moment[...]

Same here. I bought SE5 and Guns of August recently but had only time to take a short look at them till now... (Sometimes I wonder why I buy far more games than I will ever be able to play. ).

[Sol Invictus]

I spent the last two years staring at the walls of my house in desperate need of good wargames; now I have ACW, Guns of August, EU3, Kingdoms:TW very soon, and Napoleon's Campaigns in a few months. You Developers need to coordinate your releases better.

[Adlertag]

About Guns of August, critics said IA is very light, almost inept. Do you feel like that?
I read also that interface is not very intuitive...
I was tempted to buy this game but reading dedicated forums ( Matrix ) let me very skeptical now. leure:

[Primasprit]

About Guns of August, critics said IA is very light, almost inept. Do you feel like that?
I read also that interface is not very intuitive...
I was tempted to buy this game but reading dedicated forums ( Matrix ) let me very skeptical now.

There are two reviews I know of:
http://www.wargamer.com/reviews/gunsofaugust/default.asp
http://www.gamesquad.com/index.php?option=com_articles&id=8&pform=&aid=164

I felt the public response at Matrix about the game also quite good, after the first shock that it only supports 1024x768 (with the first patch, at the moment public beta, it also supports 1280x1024 and 1200x800). The Support by the designer/developer seems also very good and the price is OK.

Can't say much about the game, since I would need to play it.
But as a first step I bought a bunch of WW1 books, to get an idea what's going on.

[Sol Invictus]

The interface is a bit different, but it is easy to pick up and is not really an issue for me. I think the AI is actually quite good compared to other games. The weakest part of the game is the manual, which doesn't explain many things that the player needs to know. You can pick up most of these "hidden" pieces of info on the forums and Frank, the developer, is quite active and helpful on the forum. If you are interested in WWI It is a definite buy.

[Adlertag]

Thanks, it's true very few games cover this period of history at strategic and operational level so it is rather attractive.
But unfortunatly, I don't still see any patch released... so I'll wait a bit more before using my credit card.

[DSMyers1]

The GamersGate-Newsletter informed me that it is out now. So has anyone tried it already?

Yes, I have Napoleon's Ambition. Primarily, it is simply an expansion for EU3 that focuses on fixing and improving the game as a whole, rather than actually focusing on the Napoleonic Era. As a Napoleonic sim, it is not really good, as the engine is not dedicated to that era. For a good Napoleonic sim, go instead for a game built for that era...Ageod's upcoming title. If, however, you want to make EU3 vastly better (and faster-running) get the Napoleon's Ambition expansion. It makes the game, in my opinion, finally surpass EU2 1.09. And more patches and improvements are on the way, along with some outstanding mods.

[Primasprit]

[...]. If, however, you want to make EU3 vastly better (and faster-running) get the Napoleon's Ambition expansion. It makes the game, in my opinion, finally surpass EU2 1.09.

Really? So it brings back the 2D map? (SCNR)
I will try it for sure (a bit later... wait for 1.1. ).

And more patches and improvements are on the way, along with some outstanding mods.

No doubt, the Paradox community produces really great mods.

[Henry D.]

[rant.exe/ON]So it is basically a patch with some enhancements that bring back useful features already known from EU2 but omitted in the original release of EU3? For which You are suppposed to pay extra to boot? And still no historical events?

If I'm not mistaken, J. A. himself posted at Paradox Plaza, that historical events would not be included in NA or any future "expansions", because only "a very small hardcore fanbase" asked for them... Must have been nearly only all the Germans then, since at non-developer controlled Strategycon Interactive Forums NA ist nearly unanimously rejected because of the lack of historical events. They only ones still somewhat hot for it over there are those "newcomers" who got into Paradox games by HoI and HoI2 and know EU and EU2 only from those boring tales about the good old times frequently told by us grumpy old farts... apy:

IMNSHO Paradox went a long way downhill since they seemingly began to make the big bucks with HoI1/2 in terms of costumer support and patch policy (publish a game buggy as hell, deliver two or three free patches which only solve some issues while creating some new ones, then publish an "expansion" for good money and stop to support the "basic" version altogether so that everybody still on the hook will HAVE to buy it in order to "maybe" finally get what the original release promised in terms of playability etc., leather, rinse, repeat), to an extent that I, former Fanboy of the company myself, very much doubt I'll ever buy another paradox game again... [rant.exe/OFF]

P.S.: PT, Pocus at al.- Don't YOU ever change!

[Primasprit]

[rant.exe/ON][...]IMNSHO Paradox went a long way downhill since they seemingly began to make the big bucks with HoI1/2 in terms of costumer support and patch policy (publish a game buggy as hell, deliver two or three free patches which only solve some issues while creating some new ones, then publish an "expansion" for good money and stop to support the "basic" version altogether so that everybody still on the hook will HAVE to buy it in order to "maybe" finally get what the original release promised in terms of playability etc., leather, rinse, repeat)[...]

Yes it seems they have learned to get most money from their customer base. As other people already mentioned this expansion appeared quite fast...
Wasn't EU3 the first game they jumped also on that rip-off train called 'Collectors Edition'? But on the other hand they still make unique games and I am looking forward to the Crusader Kings expansion and give them more and more of my money.

P.S.: PT, Pocus at al.- Don't YOU ever change!

Hehe... also Ageod will change, for sure. Nothing will be the same once they have 4 games released.... and people start complain that not every problem can be fixed in a few days... and that Philippe&Philippe don't answer to every question anymore or not fast enough...

[Henry D.]

Yes it seems they have learned to get most money from their customer base. As other people already mentioned this expansion appeared quite fast...
Wasn't EU3 the first game they jumped also on that rip-off train called 'Collectors Edition'?....

Ahhh, don't get me started on that...

Though, If this CK "expansion" turns out to be nice (and released as a hard copy), I might break my own pledge and buy it (Weak mortal that I am... ). CK was the last Pdox game I really enjoyed for a long duration of time...

Hehe... also Ageod will change, for sure. Nothing will be the same once they have 4 games released.... and people start complain that not every problem can be fixed in a few days... and that Philippe&Philippe don't answer to every question anymore or not fast enough...

Actually, I'm already wondering how they still manage to do that. My guess is very sophisticated cloning technology and that there are at least three of each of them around...

[Rafiki]

Hehe... also Ageod will change, for sure. Nothing will be the same once they have 4 games released.... and people start complain that not every problem can be fixed in a few days... and that Philippe&Philippe don't answer to every question anymore or not fast enough...

By then, they'll have sold so many games that they can afford to hire a *lot* more people

[Primasprit]

By then, they'll have sold so many games that they can afford to hire a *lot* more people

Yep, people who tell them that they can earn more money selling "collectors editions" or make expansions instead of patches or that it might be better to show the bug threads only registered users...

[Primasprit]

Ahhh, don't get me started on that...

Though, If this CK "expansion" turns out to be nice (and released as a hard copy), I might break my own pledge and buy it (Weak mortal that I am... ). CK was the last Pdox game I really enjoyed for a long duration of time...

CK is the Paradox game I played most. Great concept, sadly the game felt kind of incomplete. A expansion is better as nothing, but I really wished for a part 2. (A bit annoying was that it took a year or so till it was in a state that it run stable enough and without save game corruption.)

[PhilThib]

Did you know it was I who made the CK original concept design in 2001-2002...unfortunately, the collaboration with Paradox ceased before I could have the game done my way... leure:

[Primasprit]

Did you know it was I who made the CK original concept design in 2001-2002...[...]

No, I did not know! Really great and unique game concept, to bad that it is somewhat unfinished in Crusader Kings. But you shouldn't have revealed that.... because now people (or at least me ) will start to demand a Ageod-Version of CK!

[Rafiki]

Yep, people who tell them that they can earn more money selling "collectors editions" or make expansions instead of patches or that it might be better to show the bug threads only registered users...

Heh, I'm one of the guys who spent money on a collecter's edition of the game in question, and I don't regret it. I guess I'll just submit myself to the group containing the "useful idiots"

[DSMyers1]

[rant.exe/ON]So it is basically a patch with some enhancements that bring back useful features already known from EU2 but omitted in the original release of EU3? For which You are suppposed to pay extra to boot? And still no historical events?

Yes and no. The historical events are definitely there--It's just that they are not nation-specific for the most part. The idea of the new event system is to allow the same type of historical events to fire for ANY nation that is in the same position as the country that had that event in real life. Essentially, there were only one or two events for many of the minors in EU2. Now, if you fulfill the conditions, you can get the events. While this is good in theory, as yet the engine has not been taken full advantage of. The mods, particularly Magna Mundi, turn the game into a historical event-filled game with more contextual events than EU2, and triggering far more realistically--the events depend far more on your play than the events in EU2 did, which happened no matter how you played. The issue, then, is not the event system at all. It is the event files themselves. Right now, there are few "flavor" events that made EU2 so fun and immersive. The meaty events are there, and work at least as well as they did in EU2. They now consider your play far more. In theory, this system is miles better than that of EU2, provided there are enough events and the triggers are properly coded. And that time is just about here.

If I'm not mistaken, J. A. himself posted at Paradox Plaza, that historical events would not be included in NA or any future "expansions", because only "a very small hardcore fanbase" asked for them... Must have been nearly only all the Germans then, since at non-developer controlled Strategycon Interactive Forums NA ist nearly unanimously rejected because of the lack of historical events. They only ones still somewhat hot for it over there are those "newcomers" who got into Paradox games by HoI and HoI2 and know EU and EU2 only from those boring tales about the good old times frequently told by us grumpy old farts... apy:

IMNSHO Paradox went a long way downhill since they seemingly began to make the big bucks with HoI1/2 in terms of costumer support and patch policy (publish a game buggy as hell, deliver two or three free patches which only solve some issues while creating some new ones, then publish an "expansion" for good money and stop to support the "basic" version altogether so that everybody still on the hook will HAVE to buy it in order to "maybe" finally get what the original release promised in terms of playability etc., leather, rinse, repeat), to an extent that I, former Fanboy of the company myself, very much doubt I'll ever buy another paradox game again... [rant.exe/OFF]

P.S.: PT, Pocus at al.- Don't YOU ever change!

I don't believe that Paradox has gone downhill much... They've always published buggy games. I believe that you will see very good support for EU3 and NA because Johan likes the game--we'll probably see patches coming for several years like we did with EU2. Many of those patches Johan did on the weekends.

I just wait until the game has gone through a few patches and get it cheap on Ebay. That's how I got the collector's edition for $20, counting shipping.

And what issues the game has are almost always solved by the modding community. For instance, a scenario editor that can edit most all the files and can modify save games was made by my brother for EU3. The community is very strong...

I hope AGEOD's community will grow as strong.

[Henry D.]

DSMyers:

Well, my extraordinarily cynical crystal ball tells me one thing: Once NA has been getting off, there 'll be no more noteable support for "basic" EU3. Has been the way they dealt with HoI2 -> Doomsday -> Armaggedon, the customers largely accepted it, why change this wonderful new money- and time-saving support concept? I'd be really happy if they prove me wrong, but well, I'm old, grumpy, misanthropic and, above all, usually right in such matters of business (and really sick of being it ). So please allow me to express that I don't have much hope for a P'dox change of heart.

Yes, their games were always buggy, but that was not at all my point, my point was, that they no longer seem to care if their games remain to be buggy once they rolled out a new "expansion" for which they can charge You all over again...
And although it is true that JA did like EU2 very much and made most patches from 1.06 onwards in his spare time, and although it may be true that he has simliar feelings towards EU3, I still don't see the point of having to pay extra for an update that basically just finally allows me to play the game that it was supposed to be in the first place.

And finally, no offence, please, but the arguement that most issues which Pdox themselves did not adress are taken care of by a vast and dedicated modding community... Very true, but, I dunno, when I buy a game, I somewhat expect it to be playable and enjoyable out of the box like it's, You know, finished! And that makes, for me at least, a vast difference between P'dox and say, AGEOD: The latter games, though maybe a wee bit buggy when released, were over all still playable und improved progressivly with each new free patch, while every single P'dox game I own seems to have been released with at least one big honking gamebreaking issue and, when addressed in a patch, there was always a good chance that it was replaced by a whole NEW big honking gamebreaking issue. That didn't matter much to me as long as I felt that they still cared for their product, not just their bottom line, but I lost that heartwarming feeling a good while ago (around Vicky/HoI2). It is really cool that P'dox games still have such a dedicated fanbase, who care about their games and make great efforts to improve them, but, IMHO, improving P'dox games playability/quality-wise should still be the obligation of P'dox themselves, not of their most dedicated costumers. At least, P'dox could do the decent thing and ask said modding costumers for permission to implement those homemade improvements in their own free "updates" so that THEY at least provide access to said improvement to every costumer if they are not able or willing to provide the improvements themselves...

Please do not construct the above als a personal assault on Yourself or Your point of view, which I do respect, although I can no longer share it (believe me, I once did...)

Regards, Henry

[Korrigan]

Yes, please stick on the thread subject: NA
Ths is not the place to discuss about Paradox as such. You can discuss about any game and how you appreciate it but please do not dis a company in another company forum.

Thank you,

Korrigan

[Frank E]

[rant.exe/ON]So it is basically a patch with some enhancements that bring back useful features already known from EU2 but omitted in the original release of EU3? For which You are suppposed to pay extra to boot? And still no historical events?

Glad that I'm not the only one that feels that way. EU3 was a nice game engine (except for the 3D stuff) but somehow they forgot to add an interesting game to it. At this point, I'm not willing to pay for what sounds like a glorified patch.

[Henry D.]

...You can discuss about any game and how you appreciate it but please do not dis a company in another company forum.

Thank you,

Korrigan

Sorry, You're right. It's kind of a hot button issue to me (disgruntled fanboi and all that :bonk and I got carried away.

I do apologize...

[PBBoeye]

The GamersGate-Newsletter informed me that it is out now. So has anyone tried it already?

Have not. Will not. Nor will buy from **** again.

And this is from someone who spent a great deal of time with the CORE group for #1 & #2.

So..... no.

I await NCP, or VGN, or whatever the hell it is called this week.

[Rafiki]

PBBoeye, NCP != VGN

[Korrigan]

Not quite

NCP= Napoleon's campaigns. ETA Q4 2007
VGN= Vainglory of Nations (Victorian strategy). ETA 2008

Other projects are: BoA2 (ETA Q1 2008) + 2 secret projects (ETA 2008 & 2009)

[FinnN]

From the very limited information available it seems the CK expansion is more of a kit of fixes and in-game tools (some of which really ought to have been in there originally) than anything else. That said, despite its simplicity and current clunkiness, CK is an enjoyable and unique game to play so I'll definitely be buying it. The addition of relationships between people in particular sounds like it'll add an extra layer of complexity and realism to things. I got the impression at the time that CK had been delayed and delayed and delayed until eventually they just smoothed it out sufficiently to get it out the door, the expansion looks like it'll finally (and much to my surprise) round things off.

I loved EU2, but EU3 left me cold. When they ditched the historical events, for me at least, they ditched the thing that made EU2 unique. If there's a mod out there that brings these back I may revisit the game. I also don't understand why they replaced the beautiful 2D map with an ugly 3D one that still behaves pretty much like a 2D map. If it'd had meant you could do more, or if it'd looked as good as the 2D one I could understand it but...

Right now though, I'm really looking forward to the Ageod Napoleonic game. I downloaded the ACW demo the other day and enjoyed it a lot more than I was expecting to (and I've only done the tutorial so far).

Have fun
Finn

[PBBoeye]

Not quite

NCP= Napoleon's campaigns. ETA Q4 2007
VGN= Vainglory of Nations (Victorian strategy). ETA 2008

Other projects are: BoA2 (ETA Q1 2008) + 2 secret projects (ETA 2008 & 2009)

Thank you for that, Korrigan. I could never get that straight.

Still don't understand the 'P' in NCP, however.