A tip for Union volunteers

[Gray Fox]

Four Union Volunteer elements cost the same as three Conscript or Line infantry elements. The problem with this is that the volunteers only have an initiative/discipline of 6/6 whereas the conscripts have 7/7 and the line infantry 9/9. However, McClellan, Halleck and Sigel can each train two volunteer elements per turn so that they become Volunteer-line infantry (V-line) with an initiative/discipline of 8/8. So with a bit of organization, the Union player can get a little more bang for the buck. But are V-line elements worth the extra effort?

Initiative determines which element fires first. From the AGE Wiki:

"The order of fire is determined by the initiative-values of the elements: elements with higher initiative are likely to open fire before elements with lower initiative (there is a random factor involved though!)."

So the difference between an initiative of 8 in the V-line element and a 9 in regular line infantry probably isn't too critical.

Discipline affects a factor called Troop Quality Modifier (TQM), which is:
1 + (discipline - 5) x 0.05
For 8 that would be 3 x 0.05 = 0.15 whereas for 9 it would be 4 x 0.05 = 0.20. So the difference between the two would be 0.05. The TQM is multiplied by several other factors to produce the final to hit chance. If the other factors produced a chance of 20% to hit then a unit with a discipline of 9 would get (0.2 x 0.05=0.01) a 1% greater chance to hit than a unit with an 8.

Thus, the V-liners are almost as good as the regular line infantry. After spring 1862, you can produce 6 V-line infantry per turn for more than a year, whereas line infantry usually come mixed in with conscripts or other elements. I leave McClellan in Cincinnati to train a stack of volunteers from all over the Midwest and move Halleck there to assist with his own stack. This gets me a total of about 40 V-line infantry elements in 1862. When Sigel arrives, I rail them to NYC where each can train a stack of volunteers from all over New England. This gives me a steady supply of good infantry to fill out Division cores.

[pgr]

A few more things to consider. Vol units build fast. Most inf elements come in at like 40 days (3 turns) whereas Vol units are finished in 1 or 2.

I would say the training is worth it. You get 5 more hit points once they are trained. The discipline/initiative values seem small, but there is a big difference between 6 and 7 etc. that TQM also comes into effect in the assult phase, and in seeing if a unit routs when hit... So the bigger the number the better.

I tend to use my training Officers in the same way... With the help of a Army HQ unit in the stack. That provides for experience with my up training. All my divisions get built from those camps of instruction.

[Skibear]

I'd say the turn saved building is a false economy. One turned saved building maybe, but the rest of the game in the front line taking up frontage as an inferior unit. Is there really such a rush for the union they need to compromise? McC, Siedel & Halleck should be spending their time ensuring as many conscripts can be processed into line units to fill quality divisions. The Union will rarely be under financial, recruit or WS pressure enough that its needs to cut corners here I think. Building small divisions for garrison against raids maybe but in that case they don't need upgrading by the trainers who have better things to do.

[Merlin]

Being the lone voice of dissent: Conscripts train to regulars in one step. Thus if you use leaders to train conscripts to regulars, it costs the same: 1 conscript per regular: 1:1. Thus, you have to make up your own mind regarding conscripts.

[tripax]

To me, since a brigade recruits as fast as its slowest element, I would put training leaders in cities where I am recruiting mixed brigades with conscripts in them. The conscripts train up once they are finished with their own recruitment but even before the rest of the brigade.

[pgr]

I'd say the turn saved building is a false economy. One turned saved building maybe, but the rest of the game in the front line taking up frontage as an inferior unit. Is there really such a rush for the union they need to compromise? McC, Siedel & Halleck should be spending their time ensuring as many conscripts can be processed into line units to fill quality divisions. The Union will rarely be under financial, recruit or WS pressure enough that its needs to cut corners here I think. Building small divisions for garrison against raids maybe but in that case they don't need upgrading by the trainers who have better things to do.

Time can be important, especially in the early game out west. In the April 61 campaign it is pretty easy to start running dry on manpower by mid-summer, and if Kentucky goes the wrong way too soon, you can tend to find yourself caught with your pants down as conscripts train. The Vols help close the gap.

We should draw a distinction in Vol units between the three element brigades that spawn in 61, and the "militia" units that you build. I find the 3 element vol brigades to be really useful, and as soon as they unlock, I send them to McClellan to train up. (And they jump from V to regular in one turn). As for militia units, I might build them early on as a way of rounding out odd numbered brigades, but I usually stick to regular/conscript units for the main builds. (primarily because if you go Vol happy, you have a lot of training time at 2 per.)

I wouldn't rely on them for my main effort, but here and there, the training up the vols can make for some good filler on the cheap.

[Gray Fox]

Lenin noted that quantity has a quality all its own.You're getting 4 volunteer line infantry for the price of 3 conscript/line infantry. That's eventually 4 Divisions for the price of 3 Divisions. Yes, regular line infantry have a better to hit chance...by a couple of percentage points. I stack the volunteer line infantry with an HQ and once they have an experience point their stats even off with the regulars. Also, I prefer a sharpshooter, a marine/sailor, two cav and the rest infantry in my Divisions. You just can't get a lot of plain infantry sub-units.

[pgr]

Last thing I just thought of, is that the untrained militia units have the disadvantage of being state specific, in the sense that they slow to a crawl outside their home state...unless you train em up.

so no arty in your divisions eh GF?

[Rod Smart]

the South is really at a disadvantage with the recruiters. Is there a way to mod special abilities to get an additional trainer or two?

[Gray Fox]

Artillery belongs grouped at the stack level. This is the lesson of the actual history of the Civil War, even if it possibly flies against some game mechanic.

http://www.c-span.org/video/?320927-1/discussion-union-army-field-artillery


Rod Smart, this is true. I somewhat regret noting yet another advantage the Union player may have.

[Skibear]

Time can be important, especially in the early game out west. In the April 61 campaign it is pretty easy to start running dry on manpower by mid-summer, and if Kentucky goes the wrong way too soon, you can tend to find yourself caught with your pants down as conscripts train. The Vols help close the gap.

We should draw a distinction in Vol units between the three element brigades that spawn in 61, and the "militia" units that you build. I find the 3 element vol brigades to be really useful, and as soon as they unlock, I send them to McClellan to train up. (And they jump from V to regular in one turn). As for militia units, I might build them early on as a way of rounding out odd numbered brigades, but I usually stick to regular/conscript units for the main builds. (primarily because if you go Vol happy, you have a lot of training time at 2 per.)

I wouldn't rely on them for my main effort, but here and there, the training up the vols can make for some good filler on the cheap.

Absolutely, the volunteer brigades that come scripted are great targets to get trained to regular. But I would rarely find the it makes sense to build union volunteers en-mass to try to game out a numerical advantage from a human wave horde. Especially if you are running dry on manpower. You have limited good commanders early and they need to be given the best troops possible, not dross. Frontage and CP restrictions means trying to get the best commanders with the most quality troops and with the most artillery in support into the battle line. Each to there own but treating the Union army as the Red army will rarely be standard advice for a new player to follow. It ignores a lot of intricacies of the game mechanism that simply will mean hordes of trained volunteers failing to assault decent CSA divisions.

[Gray Fox]

As I already pointed out, the difference is really minor. A volunteer line infantry may have a to-hit chance of 20% and the more expensive line infantry a to-hit chance of 21%. So this isn't about elite troops and scrubs. If you don't want to use the extra resources on more Divisions, then buy more or better artillery or cavalry.

[Captain_Orso]

Artillery belongs grouped at the stack level. This is the lesson of the actual history of the Civil War, even if it possibly flies against some game mechanic.

http://www.c-span.org/video/?320927-1/discussion-union-army-field-artillery

IIRC when the units and elements are picked through frontage to go on the battle line, if there are not enough artillery within the units picked, it will be taken from other units. I don't think you have the situation in which you have slots in the artillery/support line of the battle line empty while artillery in unpicked units stands around without use. You only get that when artillery cannot fit onto the battle line because you have more than the line will hold.

As I already pointed out, the difference is really minor. A volunteer line infantry may have a to-hit chance of 20% and the more expensive line infantry a to-hit chance of 21%. So this isn't about elite troops and scrubs. If you don't want to use the extra resources on more Divisions, then buy more or better artillery or cavalry.

You may be forgetting about cohesion. Militia has 66 cohesion, while line infantry has about 80+, which means that line infantry will stay on the line longer while militia will be breaking a retreating.

[Gray Fox]

The volunteer units have been trained to volunteer line infantry. So their now trained up status gives them a cohesion delta of only 10. Stack them with a HQ unit for a while and there's practically no difference. Also the cohesion effect is a random dice roll, so the unit with 10 cohesion may stand and the one with 90 may run. I still believe that 4 of these Divisions beat three of the more expensive ones.

P.S. The trainers can also upgrade conscript and militia cavalry to early cavalry. Conscript cav will upgrade to late cav anyway, so there's no reason to upgrade them really. However the militia cav are in unique and useful two element units. A Division can normally have 15 sub-units, so the Union can only make a "light" cavalry Dividsion with single cav elements. If you use two of the upgraded militia units with two elements each along with 13 single cav this will make a full cavalry Division with 17 elements.