Union Brigades

[marquo]

I have read the ideal composition of brigades is 4 infantry regiments, 1 sharpshooter, 1 cavalry and I art; however in 1861 I am unable to add more than one counter of any kind to a general; now that counter can have 1 or more elements of various types, but I can't more than what is in one counter. what am I doing wrong?

Thanks

[Le Ricain]

You can not add to brigades apart from single element militia brigades. It is divisions that you can build by adding brigades. In the Grand Campaign Game, you can not build brigades until October or November, 1861.

[Captain_Orso]

Ummm ... Mr R, I think you mean you cannot build divisions until ... Early October '61 .

That's not completely true about brigades, but almost. There are a few brigades that you can add to. The Missouri brigades with [X][X][/] can have a single infantry regiment added to them.

I think it's the Pennsylvania [X][X][S] that can also have a single infantry regiment added to them, but then they don't have room for a general.

But that's really pretty unimportant. Important is building a good division. That supersedes the content of any single brigade.

[Baste]

What sense to create a brigade (General + unit), if you can create a division? Of course I'm talking about after October 1861.

[Captain_Orso]

Depends on what you're up to *hehehe* ... *oops* that wasn't only inside my head was it

Especially the South with those big fat brigades they have that are almost half a division alone and need fewer CP's than the same number of Union regiments can be used to threaten less disputed areas or just to try to get behind the lines and disrupt communications.
[INDENT]If you're the Union fighting for Springfield MO with Rolla as your supply base, and one of those brigades comes rolling up out of Ozarks headed straight for Rolla, or St Louis or Jefferson, you will certainly take notice.
[/INDENT]
Of course you don't really need a general to do that, and Athena often sends them without a general; there still a brigade with or without a game-represented leader. They just have their own inherent, generic, characterless leader.

In fact that might be preferred, depending on the leader you might use to lead one of those fat-boys. If you want to do a quick strike on Rolla, a 3-1-1 leader will not do you service. He will diligently give your brigade his 2 CP's. But about half the time he will be inactivated (have the brownies) and not only slow your brigade's movement down by 35%, but also prevent it from acting aggressively
[INDENT]If the leader's not activated, he cannot go to Offensive Posture {unless entering enemy held territory} and in no way assault a location in any case. On the defensive, however, in friendly controlled territory activation makes no difference.[/INDENT]
Okay, there is a gamey trick to get around this, and ... uh ... *cough* if the leader is inactivated, just separate him from the brigade and let him march along behind the brigade (in other words, they move to the same region, but each in their own stack). This way the brigade can move at full speed, less the difference for being under-commanded, but will not lose the 35% automatically if they encounter the enemy. If the leader becomes activated underway, just recombine him and off you go.

[Ebbingford]

A good reason for changing the activation rule.........

[Le Ricain]

Ummm ... Mr R, I think you mean you cannot build divisions until ... Early October '61 .

That's not completely true about brigades, but almost. There are a few brigades that you can add to. The Missouri brigades with [X][X][/] can have a single infantry regiment added to them.

I think it's the Pennsylvania [X][X][S] that can also have a single infantry regiment added to them, but then they don't have room for a general.

But that's really pretty unimportant. Important is building a good division. That supersedes the content of any single brigade.

Damn...yes, of course, I meant divisions. I must check my medication...

[Captain_Orso]

A good reason for changing the activation rule.........

[Captain_Orso]

Damn...yes, of course, I meant divisions. I must check my medication...

Try mine

[marquo]

The reason I brought this up is that in early 1861 the Union division Generals can be activated to form brigades and attach a regiment ---> and this makes for stronger stacks. I want to know if this is WAD.

Thanks

[loki100]

yes its WAD, there is rarely a reason not to directly attach a combat unit to a leader so you should do it by default.

[Captain_Orso]

The reason I brought this up is that in early 1861 the Union division Generals can be activated to form brigades and attach a regiment ---> and this makes for stronger stacks. I want to know if this is WAD.

Thanks

From my experience, if you can add a regiment to a brigade, then it's WAD. But there are very few types of brigades that can accept an additional regiment. Any brigade can combine with a leader.

[marquo]

Here is what I am doing: select any of the early Union generals; if active the (+) sign allows addition of one regiment or artillery battery or whatever, and nothing else. Then the icon of the Division Commander becomes a brigade.

[Ol' Choctaw]

Any leader can combine with any single regiment or brigade. WAD. It is only a division if there is more than one brigade or regiment under the leaders command.

[Captain_Orso]

Here is what I am doing: select any of the early Union generals; if active the (+) sign allows addition of one regiment or artillery battery or whatever, and nothing else. Then the icon of the Division Commander becomes a brigade.

Okay, lookie here. Rhodes, the Maryland Line Bde and the 15th Virginia Cavalry are in one stack. We see that Rhodes is activated, because his envelope on his counter on the map is beige. The toop-tip on his tab would show a single bronze star behind his name, which means the same. The tool-tip from his unit itself in the Stack Panel also claims that he can actively lead troops.


When the splendifferously mustached Rhodes and the Maryland Line Bde are both selected we see that the command SO (Special Orders) section (the tent) is open and the Combine Units [ + ] button is highlighted. This means that the selected stacks in the Stack Panel can be combined into one unit. We click the Combine Units button and now we have combined Rhodes and the Maryland Line Bde to one unit, which looks like this in the Detail Panel


When we now select both the Rhodes/Maryland Line Bde combined unit and the 15th Virginia Cavalry unit we see that the Combine Units button is darkened, because we cannot combine the 15th Virg. Cav. with Rhodes. We do see that the Split Unit [ - ] button is highlighted, which means that we can split Rhodes from the brigade command.


And that's the way it works. Only divisions, which are units in game terms, can contain more the 2 units.

Hope this helps a little with your understanding the game and please feel free to ask if anything is unclear.

[marquo]

Captain_Orso,

I understand the above, much thanks. Allow me to rephrase:

I am able to form brigades with every Union Division General without exception in early 1861 before division formation is allowed. Any general with the Army of the Potomac, when active, can add in one (and only other unit); the Icon of the General becomes a Brigade icon.

Thanks

Marquo

[Ol' Choctaw]

That is correct! Every General on the map can do the same, except a few who start the game with a brigade anyway. That is Working as Designed. (WAD)

[Captain_Orso]

Captain_Orso,

I understand the above, much thanks. Allow me to rephrase:

I am able to form brigades with every Union Division General without exception in early 1861 before division formation is allowed. Any general with the Army of the Potomac, when active, can add in one (and only other unit); the Icon of the General becomes a Brigade icon.

Thanks

Marquo

As Ol' Choctaw stated, this is WAD.

What you do not have quite correct is (and some of this is just terminology or jargon, but it helps if we all talk the same talk):

To combine a leader with another compatible unit (usually a brigade, but also cavalry regiments), the leader does not have to be activated nor a brigadier general (aka: a general* or a 1star general ('general' and 'leader' are synonymous in the forums, unless we are talking about admirals or one of the spies)). Any leader not commanding an army, corp or division and not already combined with another unit my be combined with a unit which itself is not already combined with a leader.

Only when a leader (any land leader is principally eligible), is given command of a division is it considered a division commander. Calling a leader a "Division General" is ambiguous.

A brigade is a brigade. A unit consisting of =>2 combat elements is a brigade. Combining such a unit with a leader does not make it to a brigade, it already is one.