AACW vet playing Hannibal

[aariediger]

So, I got Hannibal this Chrismas, and fired it up today to give it a shot. Some thoguhts:

Eagle Eye: this is like the craziest trait I’ve ever seen! Double frontage? That’s insane! Now, I do wonder how it works. Does it only work in clear terrain/woods like the normal generals boost for attack/defense ratings? Or does it work in even in rough terrain, which would actually make it a better idea to use in rough terrain then because frontage is most often restricted there anyway. How much frontage is normal anyway. A basic rule of thumb in AACW was 3 divisions in clear terrain, plus 1 for each rating point, so 6-6-4 Grant attacks with 9 divisions and defends with 7. But now that there aren’t any divisions, how does that work?

Speaking of command structures, how does march to the sound of guns work with no corps? Is it in game at all?

I see the retreat rule has been changed to 0% minimum for this game too. Now, I understand that there weren’t many armies totally wiped out in the Civil War, which is why people wanted it that way for AACW, even though I disagreed. But in the 2nd Punic war, armies were wiped out left and right, all over the place! Why not 5%, or maybe even higher! Make those Roman armies deep in Hispania pay for losing a battle!

I love that sieges are nearly impossible. A siege in AACW was a forgone conclusion. Remember, Vicksburg surrendered an army after what would be 3 game turns. But Hannibal has sieges become massively harder, as they should be.

Military control! I move Hannibal’s big army into a region with a walled city, he takes like 95% control. Next turn I try an move him, and I need at least 10% MC in a region to move there. Makes sprinting down to the toe of Italy a bit difficult. I ended up throwing out recon forces of cavalry to clear the way. Sort of tactical level stuff going on. Cool idea! But why do I need MC to advance with a big undefeated army, while a broken Roman army doesn’t need any to get away! I actually like this cavalry advance thing, but maybe you should need something for retreats too, like a rear guard to keep the way home open. If Maharbal swings around and routes your cavalry, maybe you shouldn’t get to retreat.

Using cavalry tactically for advance and covering retreat sounds awesome, and sort of replaces the rail breaking/raiding and repair from AACW, since there aren’t any railroads to attack/fix.

Another reason to not try to fly down to southern Italy, is supply. I always sucked at supply in AACW, and if I didn’t have a bunch of railroads nearby things got real lean real fast. I pretty much only attacked where there were railroads for me to use after I advanced. Not many rails to be found in 218 BC! So I really have no idea how to keep everybody fed.

So far, I like what I see. Anybody have some hints out there? I loved the board game Hannibal: Rome vs Carthage, and have found that what works in that game doesn't work here!

[James D Burns]

Eagle Eye: this is like the craziest trait I’ve ever seen! Double frontage? That’s insane! Now, I do wonder how it works. Does it only work in clear terrain/woods like the normal generals boost for attack/defense ratings? Or does it work in even in rough terrain, which would actually make it a better idea to use in rough terrain then because frontage is most often restricted there anyway. How much frontage is normal anyway. A basic rule of thumb in AACW was 3 divisions in clear terrain, plus 1 for each rating point, so 6-6-4 Grant attacks with 9 divisions and defends with 7. But now that there aren’t any divisions, how does that work?

Eagle eye is working all the time, so basically Hannibal’s army always gets a 100% frontage boost. The larger his army size the more times it will make a difference. With smaller armies it will probably only matter in restricted terrain.

As to divisions not being in game, a legion or any other large infantry unit is basically a division, just think of it as not being able to customize what kind of elements will make up your divisions.

Speaking of command structures, how does march to the sound of guns work with no corps? Is it in game at all?

Nope MTSG is not in this game.

I see the retreat rule has been changed to 0% minimum for this game too. Now, I understand that there weren’t many armies totally wiped out in the Civil War, which is why people wanted it that way for AACW, even though I disagreed. But in the 2nd Punic war, armies were wiped out left and right, all over the place! Why not 5%, or maybe even higher! Make those Roman armies deep in Hispania pay for losing a battle!

I think you’ll find armies die pretty easily in this game. It will usually take more than one battle, but if you press an army that recently lost a fight it’ll usually be in pretty bad shape and begin to see lots of elements die. You can sometimes see entire armies die off in a single fight, but that usually only occurs if hold at all costs orders are in effect for the loser.

I love that sieges are nearly impossible. A siege in AACW was a forgone conclusion. Remember, Vicksburg surrendered an army after what would be 3 game turns. But Hannibal has sieges become massively harder, as they should be.

Sieges are easy for land locked cities as starvation sets in pretty quickly (supplies run out in two turns for units without wagons). So make sure you keep a supply wagon in all your land locked cities if you want them to last longer than a few turns. Port cities can last indefinitely if the walls are not breached. Naval blockades will make all the difference when trying to starve out a port city, just hope a storm doesn’t arrive to sink your entire blockading fleet. Storms are brutal in this game.

Military control! I move Hannibal’s big army into a region with a walled city, he takes like 95% control. Next turn I try an move him, and I need at least 10% MC in a region to move there. Makes sprinting down to the toe of Italy a bit difficult. I ended up throwing out recon forces of cavalry to clear the way. Sort of tactical level stuff going on. Cool idea! But why do I need MC to advance with a big undefeated army, while a broken Roman army doesn’t need any to get away! I actually like this cavalry advance thing, but maybe you should need something for retreats too, like a rear guard to keep the way home open. If Maharbal swings around and routes your cavalry, maybe you shouldn’t get to retreat.

You can move past cities using green/green orders stance, so unless an enemy army is standing in your way you can bypass many cities if you wish. There is no need to capture a region before you advance past it in this game, supply lines are non-existent. So don’t get caught up in a mind set of needing to create/defend a frontage. March to the target you want one turn and take it the next turn. Then either defend it or look for a new target.

Using cavalry tactically for advance and covering retreat sounds awesome, and sort of replaces the rail breaking/raiding and repair from AACW, since there aren’t any railroads to attack/fix.

Keep most of your cavalry with your armies most of the time. Pursuit losses in this game can be massive, cavalry increases them or protects you from taking them. So don’t short change your big armies by sending all your cavalry off raiding. You can usually see higher losses caused to a loser during the pursuit then was seen during the actual fight, as long as you have ample cavalry available to cause those losses.

Another reason to not try to fly down to southern Italy, is supply. I always sucked at supply in AACW, and if I didn’t have a bunch of railroads nearby things got real lean real fast. I pretty much only attacked where there were railroads for me to use after I advanced. Not many rails to be found in 218 BC! So I really have no idea how to keep everybody fed.

Supply in this game is completely different than ACW. There are no supply stocks that move around map. Each region has its own supply level and that is all you need to worry about when it comes to feeding an army. So zooming down into Italy is fine as long as you capture a town with high enough supply levels to feed your army. Remember though, you can be right next door to a high supply region in this game and you will starve to death, supplies do not move around in this game like they do in ACW.

Bring lots of supply wagons with your main army, that is all that it will have available to feed itself until you manage to capture a town. Once you capture a town build a level 4 depot ASAP to increase its supply level. Leaders that reduce supply consumption of stacks are extremely valuable in this game and should be spread out so as many large stacks benefit from reduced supply consumption as possible.

Jim

[Franciscus]

Spot on, Jim, as usual, great post, thank you.

Just some more points/clarifications (and incidentally, using AGE Wiki - link: http://www.ageod.net/agewiki/Main_Page - is recommended )

- Supply in AJE series uses the rules of simple supply, while in AACW it's "advanced supply". The main point is that supply is available only where generated, and is NOT accumulated (built up) turn to turn; although, if needed, supply can also be drawn from adjacent regions.

- Having military control over regions has the following main effects:
>Cohesion costs for movement are increased in enemy controlled regions,
>an increased Detection Level,
>an increased chance of blocking enemy movement through the region

- I also tend to keep my cavalry with my armies, specially due to their effects in the "pursuit" phase of battles as said by Jim. Nevertheless, some players also use cavalry detachments ahead of main army, for example in Hannibal's march to Italy, to gain MC in regions to be passed by the army, specially to reduce cohesion losses; also, don't forget cavalry are the main units that increase the detection value of your forces.

Hope you enjoy the game, aariediger!

Best regards

[Durk]

So one amendment to this excellent discussion. Do not supply wagons draw supply from adjacent regions as they do in WIA. That is, if my wagon(s) sits next to a major supply source, it reloads?

[Ebbingford]

The main point is that supply is available only where generated, and is NOT accumulated (built up) turn to turn; although, if needed, supply can also be drawn from adjacent regions.

Yes