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OneArmedMexican
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Saxony Capitulation event - please fix it or get rid of it!

Thu Jun 23, 2011 11:33 pm

This event has been a constant bother since I first bought RoP. At first the conditions were too restrictive, under the current beta patch it triggers far too easily.

If I understand the event files correctly, this is the core of the Saxony capitulation event series:

[INDENT]SelectFaction = $PRU
StartEvent = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_Trigger|1|0|NULL|NULL|NULL|NULL

Conditions
MinDate = 1756/09/01
MaxDate = 1757/04/01
Probability = 75

EvalRgnOwned = $Leipzig

EvalRgnOwned = $Dresden

EvalRgnOwned = $Bautzen

EvalRgnOwned = $Chemnitz

EvalRgnOwned = $Torgau

EvalRgnOwned = $Dippoldiswalde

EvalRgnOwned = $Radeberg

Actions
SetEvtOccurs = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony;MaxOccurs;1
SetEvtOccurs = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_AI;MaxOccurs;0

EndEvent[/INDENT]

1) The current in-game description seems to indicate that as long as Austria keeps one of the three streets leading to Pirna open the event cannot trigger. As I understand the conditions of the event, that is at least not the complete truth. The event checks for 7 regions and not just Dresden, Dippoldiswalde and Radeberg.

2) In my current PBEM, I ordered a Saxon sortie and repulsed the Prussian siege force. Moreover, I am in control of Radeberg (78 % MC). Files are attached (I am not hosting therefore I can only offer you the before and after game files from my side).
Can anybody explain to me how the Saxony capitulation event triggered under these circumstances? :blink:
Frankly it is ridiculous, the Saxons win two victories over the Prussian army, make their enemy run back to Dresden and during the victory celebrations they and get so depressed that they decide to capitulate??? :mad: :bonk:

Please, if it is impossible to fix this event - which I could understand; there are a miriade of possible in game situations that the event can hardly cover all - then just get rid of it.
Right now the event is only a source of constant frustration.

Sorry, I sound very grumpy. As you can guess, I am still somewhat mad. Thank you for reading my post anyway. :)
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OneArmedMexican
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Fri Jun 24, 2011 12:44 am

I thought about the Saxony capitulation event some more and came up with a suggestion:

Remove the current conditions and exchange them with two simple condition for the Saxony event:

1) NM of Austria < 100
2) time limit: March 1757

Austria starts the GC with a NM above 110 (112 I believe). A drop of ten points only happens if Austria looses a major battle. In that case it would be logical for their Saxon allies to loose hope and capitulate which in turn triggers the series of events giving Prussia and Austria new Saxon troops.
In my opinion, a check for Austria's NM is also more logical and flexible than a check for controlled regions.

March 1757 is a good time limit. After that the first Austrian reinforcements arrive. Meaning the Saxon resolve to fight gets strengthened. Besides, the Prussian player has had more than enough time to siege and conquer Pirna by that time.

As far as I can see, there is only one case where these conditions would fail: If the defenders of Pirna surrender without fighting. In that case Austria would loose only 1 point of NM. But perhaps it is possible to write a secondary event only triggered by a failed surrender check for Pirna?

My thoughts might be dumb, and I am sure there would still be sítuations where the outcome seemed illogical but at least it would be a lot simpler and predictable than the current solution.

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PhilThib
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Location: Meylan (France)

Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:41 am

I guess the NM solution could walk, but we could see some strange situation where the Austrian would NOT make any combat, in order to avoid the risk of losing a battle...and thus stay above 100 until March....thereby translating into a situation where you have the exact opposite of the desired goal.... :confused:

This is not so easy to fix. Let's make some tries
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Athens
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Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:58 am

OneArmedMexican,

Replace EvalRgnOwned by Evalcontrol (<= 60) would be a first step. Then add EvalBattle to check if a large battle has occured. Last , adding EvalAreaPowerRatio to check the ratio of forces into these regions could be useful too.
Fatal Years mod for RUS: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2875975

My blog: http://moddercorner.com/about/

[SIZE="2"]Players quotes about Fatal Years:[/size]

the more I play this the more I become convinced that RUS is one of the best strategy games I have ever played... and I have played many since the mid 80's. The AI in this mod is at level with Sid Meier's best efforts.

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OneArmedMexican
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Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:23 pm

PhilThib, thank you for the kind answer. I hope you will find a solution. :thumbsup:

Sometimes I wonder if the easiest solution would be to remove the capitulation event altogether.

Athens, thank you for your advice, too. :thumbsup:
As you can tell my skill in scripting events is rudimentaria at best. What exactly does EvalRgnOwned check for? The owner of a region, right? Isn't that the same as Evalcontrol (< 50)?
EvalAreaPowerRatio sounds promising indeed.

Athens
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Location: definitly elsewhere

Sat Jun 25, 2011 8:40 am

[color="Red"][SIZE="3"]Important: untested, not debugged. To be considered as a mere draft[/size][/color]


To do first: open the areas.ini file. Create a new areas grouping the 7 seven regions concerned by this event. Name it Aera_capitulation. Don't forget to add it into the corresponding alias file.

Then,

//Event checking if a battle a occured, causing 2NM losses

SelectFaction = $AUS
StartEvent = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_Battle_Tracker|1|0|NULL|NULL|NULL|NULL

Conditions
MinDate = 1756/09/01
MaxDate = 1757/04/01

EvalBattles = >=;1;>=;2


Actions


EndEvent

// Event for Human Prussian player, checking he both owns and controls the 7 regions and has at least as much troops in this area than the Austrians

SelectFaction = $PRU
StartEvent = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_Trigger|1|0|NULL|NU LL|NULL|NULL

Conditions
MinDate = 1756/09/01
MaxDate = 1757/04/01
Probability = 75

CheckIsPlayer

EvalRgnOwned = $Leipzig

EvalRgnOwned = $Dresden

EvalRgnOwned = $Bautzen

EvalRgnOwned = $Chemnitz

EvalRgnOwned = $Torgau

EvalRgnOwned = $Dippoldiswalde

EvalRgnOwned = $Radeberg

SelectRegion = $Leipzig
EvalControl = >=;60

SelectRegion = $Dresden
EvalControl = >=;60

SelectRegion = $Bautzen
EvalControl = >=;60

SelectRegion = $Chemnitz
EvalControl = >=;60

SelectRegion = $Torgau
EvalControl = >=;60

SelectRegion = $Dippoldiswalde
EvalControl = >=;60

SelectRegion = $Radeberg
EvalControl = >=;60

EvalAreaPowerRatio = LAND;$Aera_capitulation;100;>=;50;50




Actions
SetEvtOccurs = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony;MaxOccurs;1
SetEvtOccurs = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_AI;MaxOccurs;0

EndEvent



//Event checking if Saxony capitulated without large battle, causing 10NM to Austrian
SelectFaction = $AUS
StartEvent = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_NoBattle_cons|1|0|NULL|NULL|NULL|NULL

Conditions

MinDate = 1756/09/01
MaxDate = 1757/04/01

EvalEvent = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_Trigger;=;1
EvalEvent = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_Battle_Tracker;=;0



Actions

Set FacMorale = -10

EndEvent


// Event for AI Prussian player, unable to cope with so much conditions

SelectFaction = $PRU
StartEvent = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_Trigger_PRU_AI|1|0|NULL|NU LL|NULL|NULL

Conditions
MinDate = 1756/09/01
MaxDate = 1757/04/01
Probability = 75

CheckAILevel = 1

EvalRgnOwned = $Leipzig

EvalRgnOwned = $Dresden

SelectRegion = $Pirna
EvalControl = >=;60



EvalAreaPowerRatio = LAND;$Aera_capitulation;100;>=;50;50




Actions
SetEvtOccurs = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony;MaxOccurs;1
SetEvtOccurs = evt_nam_CMN_CapitulationSaxony_AI;MaxOccurs;0

EndEvent
Fatal Years mod for RUS: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2875975



My blog: http://moddercorner.com/about/



[SIZE="2"]Players quotes about Fatal Years:[/size]



the more I play this the more I become convinced that RUS is one of the best strategy games I have ever played... and I have played many since the mid 80's. The AI in this mod is at level with Sid Meier's best efforts.

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OneArmedMexican
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Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:14 pm

Sat Jun 25, 2011 3:18 pm

Thank you Athens, this looks very promising. I wouldn't be surprised if it served the Philippes as a blue-print for a Saxony capitulation event overhaul. The check for a battle has perhaps a too low threshold: one hussar regiment running into a Prussian stack and failing to retreat usually results in that regiment being wiped out costing - 3 NM.

One more question, can anyone explain to my why the Saxony Capitulation event triggered in the game I attached to my original post? As I understand the game files, it shouldn't have.

Athens
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Posts: 431
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Sat Jun 25, 2011 3:21 pm

OneArmedMexican wrote:Thank you Athens, this looks very promising. I wouldn't be surprised if it served the Philippes as a blue-print for a Saxony capitulation event overhaul. The check for a battle has perhaps a too low threshold: one hussar regiment running into a Prussian stack and failing to retreat usually results in that regiment being wiped out costing - 3 NM.

One more question, can anyone explain to my why the Saxony Capitulation event triggered in the game I attached to my original post? As I understand the game files, it shouldn't have.


Dunno as I've not looked at ROP files since some months :) . I will take a look at for Ultima Ratio Regum.
Fatal Years mod for RUS: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2875975



My blog: http://moddercorner.com/about/



[SIZE="2"]Players quotes about Fatal Years:[/size]



the more I play this the more I become convinced that RUS is one of the best strategy games I have ever played... and I have played many since the mid 80's. The AI in this mod is at level with Sid Meier's best efforts.

User avatar
OneArmedMexican
General
Posts: 582
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:14 pm

Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:55 pm

I have been doing a few tests with the Saxony capitulation event, something is seriously wrong with it: It seems to me that as soon as the Saxon units unlock (which will happen if some casulties are inflicted upon them during a siege), they are inevitably doomed because at the end of the very next turn Saxony Capitulation event will trigger. :bonk:

By the way, I am not the only one who experienced strange outcomes with the Saxony Capitulation event: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?513080-Learning-from-Prussia-a-Rise-of-Prussia-AAR-against-a-real-player-for-beginners see posts # 14 and # 15.

Baris
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Posts: 1914
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Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:46 pm

Saxons managed to defeat Moritz indeed :w00t: (That was Narwhal's gesture maybe ;) ) . I remember after I destroyed fortified camp,I move them the east across Elbe to save them from Prussian wrath! But a turn later they were all gone :bonk: , disappeared.

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