Don't make getting money too hard

[vaalen]

I have trouble getting enough money as the US. I know some of the really good players are swimming in the stuff, but not all of us are that good. I read that money may be harder to come by in the new patch, but maybe that could be presented as an option?

Private capital does not seem to be too much, this was the worlds greatest period of economic expansion, and new enterprises were springing up all over the world.

Government money is far too little for what I want to do.

In terms of fun, I do not enjoy struggling for money in a game.

[kayapo]

I think getting money is actually too easy. I garantee you'll feel the same way in when there is that click and you sudenly realise how the system works.

The main thing is getting your mind out of the contemporary economic mindset where countries rely on a balance of export/import and buying more then selling on a world market is a bad thing. This is not the 1990s.

The game is not about the international market. It is about the national market.
Buy a lot, buy everything. If your people want it, make sure they are getting it. If you reach their saturation point and you can't increase demand, go search for new markets to buy your products Victorian style. Colonization is to attract more people to buy your things and not to have access to exotic products.

[Caccio]

I've found that making money is impossible unless you watch the profitability of individual structures each turn, and activate/deactivate them as needed depending on the prices of their inputs and outputs. On any given turn, at least 1/3 of my structures are turned off. I use an Excel spreadsheet to track this; it's too tedious otherwise.

[montgomeryjlion]

The first 6-9 months require a fair amount of micromanagement to get everything working well.
After that, most players only need to check the economy every few months or so.
That's my experience, anyway.
And, yes, there's too much money and other things afloat in the world as it stands.

[Ingtar]

I guess it hasn't clicked for me yet. The thought of checking every single site, every single turn does not sound fun to me. I do know that trying to sell a lot on the world market does not seem to work for me.

Are you saying I should buy up all the gold and other luxury resources that I can? It seems that even though this is the only need not met, that they will not sell for enough to pay off.

[Athens]

The first 6-9 months require a fair amount of micromanagement to get everything working well.
After that, most players only need to check the economy every few months or so.
That's my experience, anyway.
And, yes, there's too much money and other things afloat in the world as it stands.

When you will have a less easy economy, micromanagement will remain after the first months.

[caranorn]

I guess it hasn't clicked for me yet. The thought of checking every single site, every single turn does not sound fun to me. I do know that trying to sell a lot on the world market does not seem to work for me.

Are you saying I should buy up all the gold and other luxury resources that I can? It seems that even though this is the only need not met, that they will not sell for enough to pay off.

If you sell during the same turn it will be for exactly the same price (unless you offered to pay 25% more to get the deal). Anyhow, buying luxuries and reselling them on your national markets will increase your population's happyness (which in turn will increase productivity) and give you tax income (money). If you have a trade agreement with the seller nation you may also improve your relationship...

Note, don't buy much more gold/gems than you can sell on your national market. Other than building up a small stockpile it probably wouldn't make much sense. And yes, you can also turn gold/gems directly into money (state), but at the risk of hightened inflation (costs)...

[vaalen]

When you will have a less easy economy, micromanagement will remain after the first months.

I think that is the point. Micromanagement of money gets tedious after awhile. I am fine with an initial effort to get things going, and periodic adjustments due to events like inventions and wars, but I want to focus more on the fantastic military and colonial parts of the game, rather than micromanage finances every single turn.

I am certain there are many others who feel likewise.

Some players are much better at this than others. I have been playing the US for two years, and I am still short of government money, though I have enough private money to build something every couple of turns, and I have learned how to avoid inflation.

[Aragos]

Ok, I only play the US (consider it a character flaw ).

Here are some hints--
1) build more gold mines in sacramento, and a railroad when you can. Gold gives you state funds and your captialists will make money off of it too

2) Build a Mechanical Goods factory on Turn 1.

3) Build, in this general order, these mines/farms: Minerals, Iron, Tropical Fruit (cotton will be a good build as well after the next patch, I think). They will help you to get your economy running and make $$ on the national market.

4) Build railroads, or build your farms/mines/factories in places that have them to start.

In a year or so, you'll have enough money to build a factory or 2 RR's a turn.

[willgamer]

FWIW, here's my take on a turn 1 checklist for the USA:

1. Eliminate all imports except dye. (Just until you have the money; then get into the import/export business ).

2. Set products to 80% if abundant; 5% if not. Especially manufactured goods, wood to 5%

3. Sell max cotton, cigars, military supplies, ammo. Later, export anything above about 100 in inventory and close down temporarily if wastage occurs.

4. Turn off West Point and the Navel Academy on the map.

5. Turn off military supplies and ammo manufacturing.

6. Turn off all, except 1, steel mills.

7. Start building a Minerals in Catskills. Then alternate building this with iron until all available structures are built out.

8. Later, try to build out manufactoring by the end of 1850 and steel, as needed, by 1851.

9. Send the spare merchant (King Cotton) to the zone that trades with England (better odds to get Dye).

10. Bring warships home.

11. Set taxes to 2/3 of max values: 5/7/60/56/0/8. (Posted somewhere that the negative impact of taxes goes in thirds, with medium being less than or equal to 2/3.)

12. Do not go to war with Indians. Bring up the colonial penetration filter and concentrate on the flashing blue areas to build up to colonies ASAP.

I make no claims for goodness; just moving the discussion along.

[Ingtar]

@Aragos: do you convert gold to money? I had not tried the gold mine approach yet, and had decided to begin again tonight with the Mechanical Goods factory on turn one. Otherwise, I had discovered the rest.

@Willgamer:I've not gone as sparse at the beginning as that, but will give it a try.

[Aurelin]

FWIW, here's my take on a turn 1 checklist for the USA:



2. Set products to 80% if abundant; 5% if not. Especially manufactured goods, wood to 5%

That part has me perplexed. No idea just how I do that. (Need a PON for Dummies book )

[willgamer]

That part has me perplexed. No idea just how I do that. (Need a PON for Dummies book )

The (infamous) F4 ledger, line 4, Constructions.

You left/right click to set the % allocated to national consumption.

Note that this is a upper limit, less may be consumed due to other limitations; you'll notice this when you keep increasing the %, but the consumption stays the same.

HTH!

[vaalen]

Thanks to all who have made suggestions. I will try them.

[Aurelin]

The (infamous) F4 ledger, line 4, Constructions.

You left/right click to set the % allocated to national consumption.

Note that this is a upper limit, less may be consumed due to other limitations; you'll notice this when you keep increasing the %, but the consumption stays the same.

HTH!

Thanks!!!

[Meagher]

The amount of money floating around would be a good feature to be able to change in the options before you start the game. Obviously different players will have different preferences. I can image some players might even want less money than historically accurate if its a multi-player game with good econ managers. Giving players more options is always good. Like the ahistorical colonization, alternative settings might not be as nicely balanced, but some players are more worried about being able to do more things in game.

[Offworlder]

It should be pointed out that the economic model found in the game portrays exactly what was happening at the time. Capital was easy to come by in most major states (excepting Austria Hungary, Russia and till the 1890's Italy) which fuelled massive industrialisation and the colonial movement. It also fuelled the massive military buildups. So private capital should not be too difficult to come by once industrialisation reallly kicks in. Of course some countries became prime importers or exporters (ex Germany with its massive chemical industry) but no country actually threatened to dominate markets as in modern times.

So no I believe that private capital, especially for major states should not be restrivcted artificially. Some may claim that its availability means that industrialisation becomes too quick. Again, if one sees the figures for the era, they are simply astounding, and comparable to the present Chinese expansion (especially for the US and Germany and to a lesser extent the UK and France while Austria Hungary and Russia absorbed a lot of capital from allied powers after circa 1905 and 1908 respectively). Such increases therefore depended upon massive capital being availabel.

[caranorn]

To echo Offworlder, a number I found a few weeks ago was: globally, an average of 4% yearly growth in the output of coal and steel from the industrial revolution until the beginning of the 20th century. That is doubling output every 20 years or so. Which means very comparable growth to today, despite the supposed slow pace of everything in the 19th century...