Civilian & War Production

[laugi2]

I am trying to understand the way civil & war productions are handle.

I can see the (number) for war levels next to the money sign but i can not find the civilian production levels

as well it will be good to know what will be the differance in production in function of the levels (Civil & War) so we can predict incomes

please help

[PhilThib]

Have you checked your statistics reports?

Civilian production is an index ranging from 9 (highest, initial 1914 level) to 0, lowest. It can only go down, by political decision of player. Every level 'lost' entails the availability of a special extra production site... on the other hand, civilian production level is added to your NW, so the more it goes down, the less your NW will come back to the (required) high levels...double-edge sword

[Tamas]

I can see the (number) for war levels next to the money sign

That IS the civilian production.

[Frank]

What i don´t understand till now is for what production sites are good for? For example if i have 2 running aircraft sites, does this mean i can only build 2 planes at once or has it an impact on the construction time? The same with shipyards and gas sites. Munition sites are well explained in the boardgame rules but the others are a bit nebulous.

[calvinus]

The principe is that the Production sites are activated only when the Civil Production (wartime economy) entry threshold is reached. Look at the IncomeTable.xls DB ([game dir]\Modding\DB folder) for details.

[Frank]

Yes i have read it already. But for what is an activated site good for?

[calvinus]

When the city is activated, all sites inside the city are activated too.

For what I remember:

• Munitions factories increment the max amount of ammo you can produce
• Ship factories increment the number of shipbuilding steps you can do per interphase on the same naval squadron.
• Airplane factories increment the number of air squadrons you can repair/produce.
• Zeppeln factories work like airplane factories but only for zeppelins
• Gas factories are checked during land battles when adopting the Combat Gas doctrine (GasTableModifiers.xls DB, [game dir]\Modding\DBs folder) as it gives a combat factor bonus if at least one gas factory is available

[Frank]

Thanks Calvinus. This helps me a lot. So this basically means if i have 2 active aircraft sides i can build 2 aircrafts, build 1 and repair 1 or repair 2 aircrafts?

[calvinus]

He remember so, but I'm not sure 100% of that. WW1 is a monster game.

[Frank]

If next year the release version of World in Flames is in a similar state as this game i will be happy. Be glad that you must not program WiF.

[Rafiki]

I think all of us are glad we don't have to program WiF....

[Frank]

And to write the manual. I have read somewhere it has over 700 pages.

[PhilThib]

Nope, 240 pages so far

[Rafiki]

(I think he was refrring to the WiF manual... )

[laugi2]

That IS the civilian production.

Tamas

are you sure about that?
1- when you point your mousse a text said (war economie/hits) and on a previous games i transform civil into war 2 times during the winter of 1914 both where succesfull ant the number when up by 2 to (10).

so my point is the(number) look like it is war eco. anyway thabks for the help, i guess i am missing something and will try to learn reading the post.
Thanks

[calvinus]

Civil Production and War-Time Economy are synonims. The lower this value is set (max 9, min 0), the more War-Time economy works, but the lesser its expeditures are redirected to the Civilian Production, so generating social problems.

are you sure about that?
1- when you point your mousse a text said (war economie/hits) and on a previous games i transform civil into war 2 times during the winter of 1914 both where succesfull ant the number when up by 2 to (10).

This is a bug fixed with 1.0.4a. In fact, the political actions "Improve War-Time economy" were wrongly scripted (see PoliticalOptions.xls DB, [game dir]\Modding\DBs folder, rows #41-#48 PO_WarfareEconomy). The parameter was 1 instead of -1, so causing an increment of civil production, instead of a decrement!

[Dobey]

Civil Production and War-Time Economy are synonims. The lower this value is set (max 9, min 0), the more War-Time economy works, but the lesser its expeditures are redirected to the Civilian Production, so generating social problems.



This is a bug fixed with 1.0.4a. In fact, the political actions "Improve War-Time economy" were wrongly scripted (see PoliticalOptions.xls DB, [game dir]\Modding\DBs folder, rows #41-#48 PO_WarfareEconomy). The parameter was 1 instead of -1, so causing an increment of civil production, instead of a decrement!

Actually I have had this problem after install of patch 1.04a. I increased Britain's war economy and it went from 9 to 10 and income became negative.

I din't try it on the original game instal so I don't know if this is new or not.
In fact the British economy seems to have bugs in general. For example it is impossiblt to increase the Munitions Production slider above zero.

[laugi2]

Philippe or calvinus

can you explain the exel incomes tables. it does not make sense to me.

ex: nation germ civil prod. 0 incomes 218 mun. flow 9 etc...

it can not be more incomes(civil) with more war factories(gas, navy, aviation) beeing in production, this should be reverse. I will think that civilian are draw in those war factorie so the civilian incomes(EP) go down because war factories are been fill to pruduce more war material.

please help

[laugi2]

Civilian make EP (incomes)

war economie fill the jobs in the war factories

War economie transfert civilian into war factorie to produce more gas, ammo, navy, plane = less civil economie so less incomes

is this correct?

[PhilThib]

No, not less income, but less National Will bonus....

[laugi2]

ok understood
thanks

[laugi2]

and by the way the game look good

[ctwino]

Follow up question. I am Germany and have wartime wconomy of 4 (according to the parenthesis next to my money icon), though in statistic report it says it is at 5. OK either way, the tables in the excel sheet to me imply that some factories should be activated in my cities. Well in the top table it has Berlin, Breslau, Dresden et al and in none of these regions are sites activated. It is early in the game have they just not passed a check?

[dougbush93]

Thanks to Calvinus for pointing us all to the tables! Very handy for understanding the game.

How to Read the Production Chart

For example Germany at Civilian Production level 9:

1. Income 130 - These are "economic points" (EP), which are like "money" to buy corps, ships, planes, technology, ambassadors, etc

2. Munition Multiplier - Very important. This is how many munitions each munitions site can produce in a given turn.

3. Sites - Names of the production sites. Some are for munitions (have little shells on the map, some are aviation, some are gas, some are naval)

4. Flow - Not quite the right name(?), this number appears to be the number of mun sites if this lines up with the boardgame production charts

5. Gas - # Gas production sites, main function is a modifier for gas table rolls

6. Naval - Number of shipyards. Main function in board game is how many extra (more than 1) shipbuilding boxes can be "bought" each interphase for any one ship. More = more shipbuilding capacity.

7. Aviation - Impacts the number of aviation units that can be repaired in a given interphase. More sites = more repaired units.

Munitions Production Example:

Max munitions production = (# of sites) * (munitions multiplier)

i.e. Germany @ civilian production level 9 has 7 munition sites and a munitions multiplier of 1, so max per turn is 7 (sites) x 1 (mun multiplier) = 7 munitions

Then, to calculate the cost for any given # of munitions per turn, the game cross references the "munitions cost" excel file, where the X axis in yellow along the top is the # of shells per turn and the Y axis = the # of production sites available. So, for Germany to produce 16 shells per turn with 8 sites = 24EP (cross reference 16 across the top and 8 on the left side). That would only be possible, of course, if Germany had a munitions multiplier of at least 2 and 8 production sites available (can't happen until civilian production level 6).

An important issue is "number of production sites available", especially for France is lower if the sites (Lille and Reims, for example) are under enemy control. If they are, they obviously can't be used for French munitions production.

So, the path to more munitions per turn is lowering the civilian production level to get more sites in production and get more mun from each site (the munitions multiplier). The only downside is the lower the civilian production level, the less NW bonus a nation receives in the interphase.

One big problem: the munitions production slider does not appear bound by a nation's current # of production sites and the munitions multiplier. For example, I am able to put the munitions slider at 25 shells / turn for Germany during the Fall 1914 interphase, even though I should only be able to set it to a max of 7 shells per turn. However, my real production was what it should have been (7 per turn). Ensuring that the slider matches up with the current possible max production would help clarify things for players.

Hope this helps a bit.

Doug

[ctwino]

I guess my question is (and thank you VERY much for the above): when I mouse over any production site of a region, it says it is not employed because war production level, etc (I dont remember the exact msg Im not at my gaming pc). ARE they actived/producting and the mouse over is just not updating? I have definately noticed increased income, though some of that is from war loans

[ctwino]

Anyone?

bump

[Tamas]

Anyone?

bump

With 1.04g, you can see on the map which site is used, which isn't.