Supply, reinforcements, replacements

[gwgardner]

Having read the several threads here about supply and unit/element replacements and reinforcements, I realize that the details of that have really gone right over my head during play - it's a part of the game I have ignored, no doubt to my side's detriment.

So I wondered: how hard would it be for you guys to add a bit more detail to the unit/stack info when the cursor is over it: a short line something like, 'using x suppy chits, drawing from x province,' or 'replacing at the rate of ...'? Whatever is appropriate.

[Pocus]

if you pass the mouse over the cauldron icon, you get total supply consumption and stock.

[Jagger]

Having read the several threads here about supply and unit/element replacements and reinforcements, I realize that the details of that have really gone right over my head during play - it's a part of the game I have ignored, no doubt to my side's detriment.

So I wondered: how hard would it be for you guys to add a bit more detail to the unit/stack info when the cursor is over it: a short line something like, 'using x suppy chits, drawing from x province,' or 'replacing at the rate of ...'? Whatever is appropriate.

I find the information provided by the tooltip very useful. However the information is useful when considering the ability of your units to operate without a supply source rather than resupplying at a supply source.

Basically the game has two different supply situations. One is use of supply when operating in the field and a second situation is maintenance/resupply when located at a supply source. The tooltip provides useful information on consumption of supply during operations when resupply is unavailable or very limited but it does not provide useful information for resupply.

When you use your tooltip to examine a formation's supply information, you will find the total supply points contained by the formation as well as the monthly supply use of the formation.

Example: You have 4 fully supplied militia regiments and a supply wagon. Each of the militia regiments have 16 supply points for a total of 64 supply points for the 4 militia regiments and the supply wagon has 64 supply points. Thus the total supply point stock for the formation is 128 supply points. This is the first number provided by your tooltip over the supply icon.

The second number is your monthly supply consumption. Each militia regiment uses 8 supply points per month for a total of 32 supply points consumed by the 4 regiments. The supply wagon uses 4 points per month. Thus the total monthly consumption by the formation is 36 supply points. This is your second number representing formation monthly supply consumption. (Note that your units consume precise numbers of supply points unlike supply sources which provide exact supply chits. This is where the wastage concept comes into play.)

By comparing the two numbers, 128 total supply points and monthly consumption of 36 supply points, you now know that your formation can survive approximately 3.5 months in the field or beseiged before starvation becomes a major duty problem. If the formation did not contain a supply wagon, then the total supply would be 64 supply points with a useage of 34 points per month. Then the unit would only survive 2 months without supply which is typical for most regular units. (It is also very useful to know that most beseiged cities/forts will only last 2-3 months before losses begin due to starvation if they lack supply wagons.)

Information on survival time without resupply is very important when planning operations. How long can I maintain a siege of a fort before running low on supplies? How long can my formation survive a seige before relief must arrive? Or can my formation go cross country through the barren west to reach Fort Niagra...and return if the assault fails, without starvation? I have discovered the hard way that units will die when out of supply.

I find the tooltip gives very useful information for operations but really is not applicable to resupply or locating an appropriate region which will meet the monthly supply needs of a formation.

A second number which provides the supply levels, not points, needed from a supply source to 100 percent maintain/resupply a formation's supply requirements would give a complete picture of the two important supply considerations of a formation.

For example: The 4 militia units and 1 supply unit might have the following information. "Your current stock is 128 supply points, your useage is 36 supply points per month. This formation requires a 9 supply level source to maintain 100 percent supply."

Perhaps something for the future "to do" list? It is not really hard to calculate ourselves but it would be more convenient to simply use the tooltip and might help those of us mathematically or time challenged.

[Pocus]

except that your force is often not alone, so this can be misleading.

[Jagger]

except that your force is often not alone, so this can be misleading.

Would that make a difference? The resupply levels are per unit. So even if you have multiple formations, the total supply levels of all formations would be an accurate reflection of the total supply needs of all units. Assuming you wanted to base several formations at the same supply source, you would simply add the needed supply levels of each formation and compare to the supply level of the source.

Yes or perhaps I am misunderstanding something of the process?

[Pocus]

you said in your example 'your force need a supply level 9 source'... true, but if another need a level 4 supply, then you need to be in a level 13 region to be supplied, so this is misleading.

[lightsfantastic]

More supply distributed by structures: (dynamically applied to current games)
(per level)
Indian village: 2 > 3
Harbor: no change
City: 1 > 2
Depot: 10 > 20
Fort: 5 > 6

(these values can be tweaked by users, in the gamedata\structures directory)

I have been playing 1.12 with these values. Makes Depots really valuable, as they should be, but I think the city level might be a little to high since there are multiple levels of cities. Would 1.5 or 1.25 work in the game or do the values need to be whole numbers?

From the 1755 Campaign using 1.12a numbers


What about these numbers?
Indian village: no change (2)
Harbor: no change (1)
City: no change (1)
Depot: 16 with a FillAmmo value of 2
Fort: 8

This keeps the more restrictive supply rules in play (which I like) and really makes the control and construction of forts and depots really count without making areas for uber-stacks to congregate in the level ten cities.

From the 1755 Campaign using the above numbers


For comparison 1.12 supply numbers same 1755 Campaign

[Pocus]

the problem would not be in the biggest cities, but in the small network of towns that cover the map, and which are very important for the British AI and to a lesser extent to the American one (players suffer less from stringent rules than the AI also). If you want a British AI that don't melt her armies away in a matter of turns, then you have to up the supply generated by towns and villages. Upping Depots would not do much good in this case, because even if the Ai can build supply, she is slow to do that and they are not as well placed as players built depots.

The decision was weighted with that in mind, but as you know, you can play the game the way you want with a modding done in a matter of seconds.

[lightsfantastic]

the problem would not be in the biggest cities, but in the small network of towns that cover the map, and which are very important for the British AI and to a lesser extent to the American one (players suffer less from stringent rules than the AI also). If you want a British AI that don't melt her armies away in a matter of turns, then you have to up the supply generated by towns and villages. Upping Depots would not do much good in this case, because even if the Ai can build supply, she is slow to do that and they are not as well placed as players built depots.

The decision was weighted with that in mind, but as you know, you can play the game the way you want with a modding done in a matter of seconds.

I thought that was why. In that case what about these?
(per level)
Indian village: 3
Harbor: no change
City: 2
Depot: 10
Fort: 5

That would give ATHENA the town/village support she needs but keep the Depot & Fort SP the same as 1.12. Or are Depots supposed to supply 10x and forts supply 3x what one city level will do?
In the above example
Albany would have 22 SP
New York would have 45 SP
Halifax would have 30 SP

I'd like to try to strike a balance between Human and AI play. I don't mind doing some testing.

Oh yeah,
You rock!