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In my current campaign my first experience with prissy generals was with Old Man Scott. While the Army of North-Eastern Virginia was still trying to get its reinforcements in place, the good ol' CSA sent Beauregard with 2 nasty divisions in to give them a good rap and then walk on into DC . It took 4 turns to get enough troops into fighting order to squash this insolence, which probably functioned more on account of Beauregard being unsupplied once reaching DC than my masterful handling of the AoNEV . (First lesson of the game: 'locked' units only unlock if they are actually hit by an attack and not just besieged surprise surprise).

So all the reserves in DC were unlocked. Then because McDowell, busy as he was, didn't attack Manassas, or anywhere else south of the Potomac, he was 'replaced' by McClellan. That is to say, the army was disbanded and McClellan was transported from Cincinnati, where he was busy training conscripts (the only good use for him IMHO), to the army stack and I could choose who to put in command. Not being a masochist, I decided to put McDowell back in command and swallow the NM loss hoping to be able to make up for it more easily with McDowell, than to live with McClellan until Lincoln gets fed up with him.

When I put McDowell back in command, guess who piped up and complained more than McClellan. Old Man Scott! If I'd have even dreamed that Scott COULD have taken the position, I'd have given it to him, but he's the CiC. I mean, he's a 3-3-3 general! and I didn't plan on having my army commander actually leading troops, because between McDowell's 2-2-2 and McClellan's 1-1-2 who wants to starve on the vine waiting for the brownie to be eaten? Anyway, Scott's already chomping at the bit waiting for retirement.

So McClellan is back in Cincinnati training conscripts again, I'm building two more army HQs, one for Tennessee and on for the Western Command, and I'm just getting ready to give the one to Halleck when Buell arrives. (I've really got to check the arrival dates for these guys). And I think, "cool, he's 2-2-2, way better than Halleck's 1-0-1". Army HQ into Buell's stack, quick check of the tool-tip to see what McClellan has to say

I'll swallow the 15 NM any day to keep McClellan out to pasture, but 347 VP

I should have just given him a militia regiment and sent him headlong at the enemy until he either gets demoted from losing too many battles or killed, which ever comes first

Has anybody else seen such a steep penalty for passing-over McClellan?

McClellan has seniority 4, Buell has 11. I just got the allowance to promote Grant to Lieutenant General, which of course I'm going to do, which should give him seniority 8, according bburns9's 'List of Union Commanders', so I'll wait another two turns to see what happens.

Dang, McClellan's such a prima donna.

Yeah McClellan has a huge penalty. Amazing that Scott gets angered though. This is yet another example of how new game quirks are added before they are properly tested. Who is supposed to testing this stuff??

Well, if the entire Washington defense stack got unlocked, that would include Scott. Scott, being a 4-star, is able to lead an army; at seniority 1, he has the most of all Union generals. So that's why he complained when you gave command back to McDowell. I can see why you wouldn't want him taking an army command anyway; he gets removed by event around October of that year, so you'd suddenly have an army without a commander.
And yes, I've seen worse for shafting McClellan; one time I was playing vs. the AI and I accidentally forgot about McClellan and gave my first army HQ to Fremont. I lost 20 NM because of it. McClellan is a whiny brat until the second "McClellan removed" event fires; then he's still a whiny brat, but with only a 5 NM penalty.

But Scott is the Commander in Chief of the Army. Basically he always did have control over the AoP historically. Just as much as Lincoln did. Just not to much avail. If Scott had wanted to take charge of the AoP, he could have done so any time. But he was 76 years old, frail and his health was failing apy: and he knew it.

Personally I believe Winfried Scott should not be eligible to takeover the AoP, simply out of historical reasons. Maybe I'm the first person to ever run into that situation. Would say a lot about my gaming.

But Scott is really just a minor poke in the side that I can smile about. I would have let him have a go at it, if I'd have thought that it was possible. It just never crossed my mind. I mixed reality with game and only considered McClellan as the only rival candidate to worry about.

Mac is the real PITA. I've passed Mac over at every occasion, but I'm fairly certain that I've never had to pay such I huge VP penalty. Maybe 20 or even 25NM, but 15 MN AND 347VP! Mac must be buying ladies of ill-repute for half of Washington.

I'm going to make sure he make intimate acquaintances with Nate Forest before the year is out.

Don't think the game allows you to kill off a 3 star general. Though I did manage to lose 2 star Milroy to my wily PBEM opponent! May he RIP (Milroy, that is).

C'mon!! be a man!! Stick to Lil'Mac at least for a while!
He will make things much more interesting for you at the head of the Army of the Potomac

gchristie wrote:Don't think the game allows you to kill off a 3 star general. Though I did manage to lose 2 star Milroy to my wily PBEM opponent! May he RIP (Milroy, that is).

With the new patches (I forget which one), it is possible to kill a 3 star, though the chances are slim.

BB

gchristie wrote:May he RIP (Milroy, that is).

Sure.....I'm sure you meant Milroy

The easiest way to kill a prissy general is to let him starve (with his troops of course). If you make him a division, and let it starve, then chances are good that he will die with the troops. If he is on his own, then he "won't" starve (you can use this tatic to keep a good general alive after a failed raid to say sunny Wisconsin, or maybe Niagra Falls).

LOL never thought about letting him starve I was actually just thinking about making him lose. I've had one general, don't remember if it was Mac or not, that got demoted for losing a battle.

Alas, it's just turning into Spring, so it will be exceedingly difficult to put Mac on a diet.

Give Mac his army, then send him somewhere. The Union gets alot of armies, so they wont' miss one.

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Gray_Lensman wrote:I suspect it has something to do with Scott getting unlocked which is very rare but maybe you should test it out yourself since you are so great at leure: about every little thing that doesn't conform to your specific expectations.

I knew Grey would chime in on this one (it would offend me too btw). I actually think it's kind of a cool effect. Scott gets a taste of the action and instead of riding off into the sunset quietly, he decides to petition Lincoln for one last hurrah with the AotP. If that happened to me I would throw him into commmand immediately and let him drive as quickly as possible towards Richmond. See what the old boy could do!

In a couple of my PBEMs the old boy repulsed attacks on DC.

Captain_Orso wrote:LOL never thought about letting him starve I was actually just thinking about making him lose. I've had one general, don't remember if it was Mac or not, that got demoted for losing a battle.

Alas, it's just turning into Spring, so it will be exceedingly difficult to put Mac on a diet.

Not necessarily, I hear that the swamps of Louisiana are nice this time of year, and just think of what they could do for Mac's complexion. Just give him a cav unit or 2, and send him off to explore (waving a fond good-bye as you do), and tell him to avoid battle (otherwise, he just gets injured).

Gray_Lensman wrote:I suspect it has something to do with Scott getting unlocked which is very rare but maybe you should test it out yourself since you are so great at leure: about every little thing that doesn't conform to your specific expectations.

Gray sorry my comment was not directed at you or anyone for that matter. It was just a rhetorical question.

Just out of curiosity, I made a copy of my current game and backed up to 1861-10-01 and put Scott in command of the AoP. Everybody was happy, even Little Mac. The in Late November Scott disappeared without notice. Isn't there a message stating that Scott went into retirement? I can't remember from my other games having seen it or not.

One things for sure. I'm glad that the position of CiC isn't part of the game, or else I'd have Mac, Halleck and God knows who else kicking my butt about that position too.

Edit: the Louisiana swamps you say .... reminds me of Lestat. You promise Mac wont come back to haunt me? At least not until the end of the 20th century.

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I have never seen a message announcing Scott's retirement.

I have run the first years of the war several times with the AI off to test different industrial investment options. So there is very little noise to hide his announcement. I will run it again to see if I can catch it.

Captain_Orso wrote:Edit: the Louisiana swamps you say .... reminds me of Lestat. You promise Mac wont come back to haunt me? At least not until the end of the 20th century.

If you manage to get him killed, then he should stay dead (should being the important word of that sentance).

Gray_Lensman wrote:You probably missed the message. It would have been one of the red messages. There's a 50% chance (per turn) that he resigns between 1861/11/01 and 1862/01/01. When the event successfully fires there's a red message accompanying it.

Easy to check for this

Search the xxx.hst file in your Saved Game for evt_nam_USA_ScottResigns1861
[or whatever event you seek].

Looks like this if not yet fired [this from turn 1, so it should be Occurences=0]:

{EventState}
Name=evt_nam_USA_ScottResigns1861
Occurences=0
MaxOccurs=1
{/EventState}

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Love them syntax exceptions!

Glad another bugsquish has occurred

Thanks guys,

Ah there he is, the poor old guy. He has all my respect for what he put up with with Mac. I'm sure Gray can appreciate his endurance

Yup lodilefty, there it is in the 1861 Late November turn:

{EventState}
Name=evt_nam_USA_ScottResigns1861
Occurences=1
MaxOccurs=1
{/EventState}