AGEOD Forums

Before heading to work this morning, I decided to take the big plunge and try a few phases of 2-player grand campaign as the Entente, this time by using a strict army-to-army setting, all the rules, all FOW, full AI, and modified LR battle AI factors.

Predictably, as I am the unlucky type, Germany took Moltke and AH took Prinz. So, I was yet again caught in the familiar Moltke-Berlin-Plan 17-Prinz bind, just like my current 4-player game as Russia.

I breezed through the Events and Diplomacy phase to go to Military phase and, OH BOY, did I feel way, way more in control of what was happening, like, you know, in a WW1 grand-scale maneuver warfare in 1914.

German I and II Army coordinating their MO, then me coordinating my own I and II Russian Army to counter-attack, and so on. In otherwords, I was witnessing, at last, some chain of reaction as the Germans take their initiative. I did not feel like in WEGO, with whole Armies passing in front of one another without any combat because one had the Initiative and moved away first, which was unthinkable in 1914 on any fronts (I can't imagine whole columns marching miles long on roads, passing beside one another without some sort of engagement occuring somewhere, yet in WEGO the German III Army can casually bypass three armies to reach Ivangorod because we must wait the end of everyone's turn to resolve combat).

This time, you see what it does and you can choose to intercept or continue your offensive. I can feel the different offensives are linked in a narrative, and that frontage can be created, even when I am in fact facing a scripted offensive.

Yeah, I know that supposedly the AI is "less aggressive" in A-to-A, whatever that means, so I do not know what to expect. Still, I feel why the original board game was balanced around A-to-A, because the situation becomes quickly muddy and frontages are less credible in WEGO (as I have seen with the German armies ending accidentally isolating themselves in WEGO on the Eastern front). This time, I can plan to isolate them on purpose, which will inevitably provoke some reaction or interception from my opponent.

That was my comment. Flame on, me loves A-to-A.

For all these reasons, so nicely depicted by you, my advice is to play Multiplayer in army-by-army mode!

calvinus wrote:For all these reasons, so nicely depicted by you, my advice is to play Multiplayer in army-by-army mode!

I thought it was impossible to play Multiplayer in WEGO.

Dumb question perhaps but when do national detachments, naval units and GQG/OHL air move in the Army by Army mode? I found nothing in the manual to say.

Random wrote:Dumb question perhaps but when do national detachments, naval units and GQG/OHL air move in the Army by Army mode? I found nothing in the manual to say.

I could be wrong, but I think they are considered akind to unattached detachments, so they are activated with the last Army HQ.

Calvinus or someone more knowledgeable can correct me if I get it wrong.

Random wrote:Dumb question perhaps but when do national detachments, naval units and GQG/OHL air move in the Army by Army mode? I found nothing in the manual to say.

not-attached units move when you activate the last army of the nation, GHQs move before you activate any armies of the nation

GHQs are moved with main armies.

Makes sense. Thanks

As I have commented, I've read warnings about the AI being "less aggressive" in A-to-A in the past. What does it actually mean, and has it been improved somewhat since then?

Drakken wrote:As I have commented, I've read warnings about the AI being "less aggressive" in A-to-A in the past. What does it actually mean, and has it been improved somewhat since then?

It's nothing dramatic. More like a gut feeling, if everything, and it concerns the agressive movement push often necessary in 1914. I saw the AI fail to do that properly every once in a while in army-to-army, while it always attempts it in WEGO.

But this should be gone once trench warfare kicks in, so if you had good results in 1914, then you shouldnt worry about it for the rest of the game I think.

I can't imagine whole columns marching miles long on roads, passing beside one another without some sort of engagement occuring somewhere,

What do they long marching for ?

This time, I can plan to isolate them on purpose, which will inevitably provoke some reaction or interception from my opponent.

You will isolate them on purpose?
Of course,isolated side will easily be intercepted by the opponent.Some tricks can be done.

calvinus wrote:For all these reasons, so nicely depicted by you, my advice is to play Multiplayer in army-by-army mode!

Oh,it is the advanced mode.Calvinus,please give some instructions.

Random wrote:Dumb question perhaps but when do national detachments, naval units and GQG/OHL air move in the Army by Army mode? I found nothing in the manual to say.

In the game ,there are the tutorial phase .Choose the last one to see the Army by Army mode.

rattlesnake wrote:What do they long marching for ?

Since WW1 Armies were massive in numbers even in 1914, armies were actually marching forward in columns over several roads before being deployed. Because of that, the marching columns often were several miles long because of the sheer volume of troops, which meant that any forward recon could theorically notice these body of soldiers marching from the rear toward the front.

Hence, why it was unthinkable that two enemy armies could march sideways over a tiny area without one spotting the other, and it would inevitably develop into some minor skirmish and, if neither disengage, evolve into a full scale encounter rapidly, just like when the German vanguard encountered a British unit in Mons where, according to Moltke, it shouldn't have been there.

That is why Belgium was so critical for the Schlieffen plan. Not because of the space per se, but because of its developed network of roads and crossroads that allowed vast movements of soldiers without clogging the network and hindering all other armies, as they worked on a very strict timetable and so couldn't afford to slow down.

You just describe the phenomena of a long army how they march with a large quantity.But it is not the reason of what they marching for.Are they looking for supply?
If two armys in the same territory ,they will battle.

Hi Drakken!

Drakken wrote:That was my comment. Flame on, me loves A-to-A.

Shame on me - I never tried the A-to-A mode. After your posting I definitely will - thank you

I don't get how and when I can use Interception and Reaction against the AI. The manual is rather unclear.

How do I react? Do I have to click somewhere? When can I select the Reaction option on the user interface? During the AI's movement, or must I "pre-book" them on the Armies I want during my turn?

Also, can I use Reaction on a unit I have already moved?

Interceptions are booked during your turn, army by army.

Reactions are booked during enemy AI turn, before one army activation finishes. So put the AI in pause mode (pause key), select the army you want to make react and click the button. Then un-pause the AI.
If the reaction booking succeeds, the AI turn is temporarily freezed and you become the active player. Thus, activate the army for which you booked the reaction and move the troops. When you sub-impulse finishes, the AI turn is restored.

Drakken wrote:Also, can I use Reaction on a unit I have already moved?

Not sure... I have to double-check if you can react with an already-activated army.

Thanks!

So, by definition, I can use Reaction on an Army I have already moved during my turn?

the one thing i dislike about army by army mode, is that it gives you the ability to cheat by moving and fighting units multiple times in a single turn. all you have to do is to just reassign the units to an army not yet activated and you get to move and fight them again when you activate that army.

patrat wrote:the one thing i dislike about army by army mode, is that it gives you the ability to cheat by moving and fighting units multiple times in a single turn. all you have to do is to just reassign the units to an army not yet activated and you get to move and fight them again when you activate that army.

Don't do it then

oh i can stop myself when playing AI. but this might become an issue if multi player becomes popular.

patrat wrote:oh i can stop myself when playing AI. but this might become an issue if multi player becomes popular.

Can easily be covered by a House rule, and in Trench warfare it becomes mostly irrelevant because of the stacking limits. Much easier just to put these in a GHQ reserve.

But in multiplayer, even if it is allowed, all players can use that trick. Cheating would be using it against the AI, as the AI does not know it can use it.

A quick solution can be to forbid tranfer of unit to/from stack that belong to already activated armies. Right?

patrat wrote:oh i can stop myself when playing AI. but this might become an issue if multi player becomes popular.

I do hope MP will become popular, but even then we will remain a close community, so a gentlemen's agreement over this should not be a problem (especially since you can easily spot trickery with this)

calvinus wrote:A quick solution can be to forbid tranfer of unit to/from stack that belong to already activated armies. Right?

Good idea.

After all, these Corps would be spent forces, too exhausted and crippled to move around as they are "busy" in their own offensive/ marching orders.

Tamas wrote:I do hope MP will become popular, but even then we will remain a close community, so a gentlemen's agreement over this should not be a problem (especially since you can easily spot trickery with this)

The more a game is complex, the more matters for home rules it needs.

When I played La Grande Guerre boardgame, I had to work out a lot of home rules to have a fair match.

calvinus wrote:A quick solution can be to forbid tranfer of unit to/from stack that belong to already activated armies. Right?

this sounds good to me.