Pbem

[Altaris]

Quoted, quickest solution is to move towards a AgeOD-like PBEM engine. A "host" executes the end-turn operation and sends the .SAV & .MAP files to all "clients". On my side I'm going to develop the PBM feature described above, that will allow you to play the shared save files without having to tweak its content every time...

I agree, that would probably solve a lot of the issues. I think this is a great game with loads of potential, but it does seem to have a lot of desync problems that could be easily resolved with a "host" player. And I would think a simple video capture program could recreate a "Replay" file similar to other AGEOD games too.

Only bad thing about PBEM is the lack of employing the combat features in the game. This has such a neat combat model with reserves and all that can't be fully utilized without human interaction during the military phases. But I think that's going to be even more prone to desync issues, unfortunately.

[Mitra]

the main problem is that, for being PBEM the combat should be splitted in turns also, so it will take infinite time. For the replay the player can anyway continue to use the ord files for verify what happen during the turn, and after proceed with the sav file. It will be a good system for verify when happen the desync because he can immediatly see the difference between ord and sav.

[calvinus]

the main problem is that, for being PBEM the combat should be splitted in turns also, so it will take infinite time. For the replay the player can anyway continue to use the ord files for verify what happen during the turn, and after proceed with the sav file. It will be a good system for verify when happen the desync because he can immediatly see the difference between ord and sav.

It's exactly what I'm doing. The PBM feature has exacly such a purpose. The host executes the end-turn procedure and saves the game, then sends the .SAV and .MAP to all clients, not the .PBM (that is a private file, each player has its own PBM file).
All clients so receive the new SAV as with AgeOD games. If they wish to replay the end-turn procedure, they can use the ORD files as you do now. Anyway, as soon the paste the .SAV and .MAP files (just received by the host) into the SaveGame folder, they do not have anymore to modify the header content of the .SAV file. It's an outstanding save of time wasted...

PROs: following this procedure will solve all desynch problems, provided that clients will not overwrite the .SAV file received by the host, of course.

CONs: all players will be requested to play with the SAME language version of WW1, because localized texts are written inside the SAV files.

[Altaris]

So what's the status on this current game? Are we waiting for some sort of bug-fix?

[calvinus]

So what's the status on this current game? Are we waiting for some sort of bug-fix?

An updated revision of 1.08Q will be available soon, hopefully during the week-end if I find no issue during tests.

In my opinion, you can designate a host player (his .SAV should be localized in English language), then proceed with the PBM feature as soon the new revision of 1.08Q is available.

[Mitra]

So what's the status on this current game? Are we waiting for some sort of bug-fix?

Actually I cannot process the diplomatic turn. So i'm blocked, my ambassadors cannot move. I don't know if at this point it is better restart when Calvinus terminated the new mode.

[calvinus]

Actually I cannot process the diplomatic turn. So i'm blocked, my ambassadors cannot move. I don't know if at this point it is better restart when Calvinus terminated the new mode.

Send me (by PM?) the savegame, so I check if there's some bug.

[Mitra]

eccolo http://www.sendspace.com/file/1lf7cj

[calvinus]

The link does not work fine. I sent you a PM.

[calvinus]

In the end the download link worked. I tried Mitra's savegame both in single player mode (not possible in PBEM mode because the ORD files not included in the zip file).
The diplomatic phase worked fine. I sent Ambassandors to target countries, scheduling missions and undoing scheduled missions. Sieges worked as designed after Events Phase. So what's working wrong?
Are you locked in PBEM play mode because lacking of ORD files? Don't you have the .BAK corresponding files of the Events phase?...

[Mitra]

No, proprio gli ambasciatori non vanno nei paesi, clicco sul pulsante, si illumina ma loro non vanno. Scusa ma tu non ne vedi due già con la busta settata? Non è normale nemmeno questo mi pare.

[calvinus]

Quando provo io gli ambasciatori vanno nella nazione selezionata. Vedo sì gli ambasciatori con la busta, ma non ho idea di cosa sia successo nei turni precedenti.

[Mitra]

HO capito cosa succede, c'è qualche strano problema di refresh della grafica. Se provo a muovere gli ambasciatori, non li vedo muoversi, ma se chiudo e riapro la schermata li vedo posizionati. Può dipendere dal fatto che ho impostato l'inglese successivamente? IN effetti succede anche al cambio turno che continuo a vede la scritta events al posto di diplomacy finchè non clikko su qualche territorio.

[calvinus]

Non credo sia legato a questo. E' un problema di mancato refresh. Il back-end del motore del gioco notifica al front-end che la grafica va aggiornata perché è stata presa in carico una richiesta di modifica della base dati, ma qualche mutex del motore grafico è lockato. In questi casi si risolve il problem forzando un refresh della mappa (si va nella finestra delle opzioni e si torna alla mappa). Molto strano in effetti...

Posso pubblicare la nuova versione della 1.08Q con il discorso PBM?

[Mitra]

per me non c'è problema pubblica pure; se è una questione di refresh per me non c'è problema, mi lascia il dubbio che poi più avanti potremmo avere altri problemi.

Guys I think to have solved the diplomacy problem, but is not sure other problems can raise after due to unknown facotr which cause this problem. What do you want do? COntinue from this point or restart the game with the new system PBM?

[calvinus]

New revision of 1.08Q is online: http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?26481-Beta-Patch-1-08Q

Guys I think to have solved the diplomacy problem, but is not sure other problems can raise after due to unknown facotr which cause this problem. What do you want do? COntinue from this point or restart the game with the new system PBM?

No need to restart. Just use the latest shared re-synched savefile after each player has edited the .SAV to make his play side active. After the new version of 1.08Q is installed, load the savegame and save it again, this will generate the .PBM file.

[poweraxe]

Then I guess we can move along, right?

[calvinus]

Yes, after each player has installed the new revision and created his own PBM file, all you can start again from the latest shared synched savegame.

[Mitra]

I moved my diplomacy turn in the path. I suppose i must rename the PBM with the same name of SAV send by the host, correct?

Altaris do you want make as host? So as summary:

1 the host receive the ord files
2 it processes them
3 he makes a first save after the process and send the sav turn to other players (I suggest to use a fixed name for this file, so to use a fixed name also for our PBM); the ord files can be used by the other players but only for have a replay idea and verify desync.
4 the other players take the sav fro the host and play it, sending the ord files like usual; the host also finish to play his turn.
5 back to point 1.

[calvinus]

I moved my diplomacy turn in the path. I suppose i must rename the PBM with the same name of SAV send by the host, correct?

Yes and no, not exactly, unless I misunderstood.
So I summarize again: the first time after the installation of this new revision of 1.08Q, you receive the .SAV from the host and you modify the content .SAV as done in the past (change header). Then you load the savegame (with WW1) and you save again, using the same filename. This will generate the .PBM file for the remainder of the game, no more need to tweak the content of .SAV files.

...summary:

1 the host receive the ord files
2 it processes them
3 he makes a first save after the process and send the sav turn to other players (I suggest to use a fixed name for this file, so to use a fixed name also for our PBM); the ord files can be used by the other players but only for have a replay idea and verify desync.
4 the other players take the sav fro the host and play it, sending the ord files like usual; the host also finish to play his turn.
5 back to point 1.

Just one (obvious) note: clients must also save the game, not only generate ORD files, of course...
This said... perfect!

[Mitra]

I have already saved the PBM with the first modified sav of last time and generated the PBM; what I mean is if the file name of sav I load must correspond to PBM file name I have (example for load turn1.sav the PBM must be turn1.pbm).

[poweraxe]

I believe so; and the .sav file name should be the same for all of us, so perhaps we should decide what the name of the .sav should be from now on

[calvinus]

I have already saved the PBM with the first modified sav of last time and generated the PBM; what I mean is if the file name of sav I load must correspond to PBM file name I have (example for load turn1.sav the PBM must be turn1.pbm).

Yes. I will explicitly add this sentence in the final version of the PBEM Manual PDF with the official patch.

[Mitra]

Altaris decide you the name, we will follow your standard

[Altaris]

What am I supposed to be doing exactly?

[Mitra]

Do you want I do as host? I think I have understood the process necessary; guys, just generate the PBM file from the shared event turn, process it, play diplomacy and send the ord file in the directory.

[poweraxe]

But what name should we use for the sav?

[Mitra]

I will use host.sav

[poweraxe]

orders posted.

[powcarrot27]

Ill be back in town on monday