Trait Questions

[Cromagnonman]

I had a couple questions regarding the actual effects of certain traits. The Occupier traits discuss imposing "Martial Law" in a "rebellious" city. How does this actually work? I've left Fremont in St. Louie for several turns, and the loyalty there doesn't seem to have changed any differently than it would have with the garrison troops alone. Does the trait actually impose a more limited version of the Martial Law option in the ledger, ie bind loyalty in that region between 2 values and cause VP loss? Is the trait ultimately likely to cause more or fewer revolts in the region? Or is there no real effect at all?

My other question regards Dahlgren's Artillerist trait. I know that he was involved in the technological evolution of artillery. But what effect could this trait possibly have for an admiral in this game? As far as I know, there can never be any artillery under his command to receive the bonus, rendering it irrelevant.

Thanks for any enlightenment.

[W.Barksdale]

As far as I can tell, Occupier, Hated Occupant, Good Population Administrator, etc. most are all still bugged. I posted these several times but I guess they slipped by everyone. They will need to be patched in a mod when someone gathers enough interest...and time :P

Dahlgren's artillerist trait: if you put him with a stack of land forces, he doesn't need to be commanding, the stack will still get his bonus.

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[Cromagnonman]

As a test I pulled Fremont back into Illinois, and the loyalty in St. Louis shot up, but my VP production didn't change. So his trait seems to reduce loyalty rather than incresae it. Looks like I just found 2 more home-front generals.

Reading the game log, it appears that Dahlgren did increase the firing effectiveness of the fleet with which he was stacked, so I guess it works. Jolly good.
PS- did not know admirals could go ashore and command landsmen

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[bigus]

As far as I can tell, Occupier, Hated Occupant, Good Population Administrator, etc. most are all still bugged. I posted these several times but I guess they slipped by everyone. They will need to be patched in a mod when someone gathers enough interest...and time :P

You might look at AACW_DB_Ability_list08d.xls in the official database files.
Most of the Parameters are not documented but you might be able to ask around to see what they refer to. You might find what your looking for here but I'm not sure.

[ATTACH]9835[/ATTACH]

You can also add or delete abilities for a leader in the Models file.

[ATTACH]9834[/ATTACH]

[Gray_Lensman]

obsolete

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[lodilefty]

Documentation of parameters is at:
http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?p=97624#post97624

[Generalisimo]

Documentation of parameters is at:
http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?p=97624#post97624

A very usefull refference guide I must say, I based all my work on VGN abilities on that. (so, you know who to blame if that doesn't work as it was planned... lodi! :mdr

[Pocus]

There is no bug, this is AGEOD!

Joke aside, I'll not leave bugs purposely in the engine, at worse if this is a nasty critter, I'll find a work around. So if you know an ability which is not working, please tell me which one.

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[mikee64]

I still believe the Seaman trait is broken as well. Here is Pocus' initial reply when I first reported this:

About the cost reduction, it is impacted on each travel time between 2 regions, so if the cost is 1 or 2 days, a -25% cost can perhaps result, because of rounding, to the same value. And a cost can never be under 1 day anyway.

I went back and did some testing after this. Below are 2 screenshots showing that even when travel between regions is 4 or more days, there is still no reduction in travel time with a Seaman leader present:


Travel time above is 4 days between regions without Semmes; adding Semmes should give 25% reduction or reduce to 3 days if working, correct?

Here is another one, travel time from Eastern Seaboard to the Blockade box is 14 days. Adding Buchanan to the fleet does not reduce travel time at all:

[lodilefty]

I still believe the Seaman trait is broken as well. Here is Pocus' initial reply when I first reported this:



I went back and did some testing after this. Below are 2 screenshots showing that even when travel between regions is 4 or more days, there is still no reduction in travel time with a Seaman leader present:


Travel time above is 4 days between regions without Semmes; adding Semmes should give 25% reduction or reduce to 3 days if working, correct?

Here is another one, travel time from Eastern Seaboard to the Blockade box is 14 days. Adding Buchanan to the fleet does not reduce travel time at all:

Seaman works quite well in WIA, so given the shared engine, it should also work in AACW

In WIA, we see 4 day moves become 3, 14 day moves become 11, etc., and the 1 or 2 day moves remain same due to roundoff... checked Coastal, Ocean and Shallow types. The only 'naval' terrain that is not helped is 'Portage', which is unique to WIA, and wouldn't make sense to benefit [how would an excellent seaman enhance dragging barges over the mud and rocks? ]

[color="Red"]WIA 26Seaman.abi [/color]looks like this:

UID = 26
Name = $abi_nam_Seaman
Alias = Seaman
Kind = $abiMoveBonus
Text = $abi_txt_Seaman
ImageID = abi_seaman.png
Color = $colAbi_Green
Appliance = Leader
Family = 0
Level = 1
Param0 = 25

and [color="red"]AACW 16Seaman.abi [/color]is:

UID = 16
Name = $abi_nam_Seaman
Alias = Seaman
Kind = $abiMoveBonus
Text = $abi_txt_Seaman
ImageID = abi_seaman.png
Color = $colAbi_Green
Appliance = Leader
Family = 0
Level = 1
Param0 = 25
[color="red"]ListParams0 = $FreezeShallow|$NoFreezeShallow|$FreezeOcean|$NoFreezeOcean|$MajorRiver|$Coastal[/color]

Note in AACW the ListParam0: those are NOT terrain types, but rather Weather Types !!!! This parameter restricts the ability to the terrains listed, and since none in the list exist, the ability benefits movement in NO terrain!!!

I tested WIA by adding the param:

ListParams0 = $Ocean|$Sea|$Lake|$Shallow|$Coastal

and with Naval Units we still see proper function, BUT: any leader defined as " Dual Land and Naval" will use the Seaman ability to benefit Land movement too!!!

So, as I don't have AACW in a game situation to try this, perhaps someone could test the AACW 16Seaman.abi with the ListParam0 changed to see if that's the issue....

In WIA, we will add the ListParam0 values, as the 'Dual Land/Naval Leader' Bougainville's Seaman ability also aids Land movement when the ListParam0 is omitted!!!!

Curiouser and curiouser.....

[lodilefty]

To 'close the last loophole', I tested WIA Seaman with the AACW ListParams0:

ListParams0 = $FreezeShallow|$NoFreezeShallow|$FreezeOcean|$NoFr eezeOcean|$MajorRiver|$Coastal

and this resulted in Seaman ability giving no benefit.

All that remains is to test AACW with the change to ensure that there is no other insidious bug in that game engine version

[lodilefty]

More snooping:

In AACW, with the revised ListParam0, it appears that Seaman has little or no effect.

However:

1. I was only testing "Palmer, with Frigates etc." in Ocean, Shallow and Coastal waters, where the Clear Movement is only 1 anyway [and so no effect can be seen]
2. [color="Red"]There does not appear to be any benefit when moving via the 'Transition Links' to/from the Shipping/Blockade boxes.[/color] I tried several 'names' for the LongTransitionLink, with no improvement.

So, can't really be sure yet about the ability in AACW, but there is definitely a need to clarify how to define the 'Transition Links' to be added to the ability. This would be useful in WIA as well.....

[Pocus]

How about 5 for starters:

1. UnitSkirmisher - You yourself informed me months ago that there was something in the code that prevented it from working with individual elements. It does work as a Leader attribute however.

Indeed, and this is working as designed, in the sense that it can't be improved to work at the unit level. This ability category alter the retreat odds of a stack so can't work at the unit level.

2. NoCapture - has never worked properly as per original design request.

I believe we never really understood each other, but after your discussion by mail we agreed that a chart showing all the possible cases (structures vs attributes present) could help me understand what you really wanted in the end. I admit that I'm confused, between what should happen if there is a depot, a fort, a city, if this is a cavalry, a raider, etc.

From W. Barksdale's post above (which I have no reason to doubt):

3. Occupier

4. Hated Occupant

5. Good Population Administrator

A saved game with the stack in the right location would hasten the resolution of the problem. I guess Barksdale has the one where he spotted the problem anyway.

[Pocus]

More snooping:

In AACW, with the revised ListParam0, it appears that Seaman has little or no effect.

However:

1. I was only testing "Palmer, with Frigates etc." in Ocean, Shallow and Coastal waters, where the Clear Movement is only 1 anyway [and so no effect can be seen]
2. There does not appear to be any benefit when moving via the 'Transition Links' to/from the Shipping/Blockade boxes. I tried several 'names' for the LongTransitionLink, with no improvement.

So, can't really be sure yet about the ability in AACW, but there is definitely a need to clarify how to define the 'Transition Links' to be added to the ability. This would be useful in WIA as well.....

In this case this is normal, as you have not added the transition links in the list of terrains, unless you are telling me you added them but this is still not working, in this case there is a bug!

[lodilefty]

In this case this is normal, as you have not added the transition links in the list of terrains, unless you are telling me you added them but this is still not working, in this case there is a bug!

I tried adding the links, using:

TransitionLink
-or-
$TransitionLink
-or-
$ter_nam_TransitionLink

with no effect. Which is the correct alias to use here?
Then I can test one more time before you dig too deep!

[Pocus]

be sure to have that in the terrainsTypes.ini alias file:
$TransitionLink = 22
$MinorFerry = 24
$MajorFerry 25
$LongTransitLink = 27
$VLongTransitLink = 28

[lodilefty]

be sure to have that in the terrainsTypes.ini alias file:
$TransitionLink = 22
$MinorFerry = 24
$MajorFerry 25
$LongTransitLink = 27
$VLongTransitLink = 28

Will go test now

[lodilefty]

be sure to have that in the terrainsTypes.ini alias file:
$TransitionLink = 22
$MinorFerry = 24
$MajorFerry 25
$LongTransitLink = 27
$VLongTransitLink = 28

That fixes it [tested in WIA]