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Captain_Orso
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Lt. Infantry with experience = Sharpshooters?

Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:23 pm

Lt. Infantry regiments with some experience could reach parameter values very comparable with actual sharpshooters regiments. So do sharpshooters get their ability from their parameters, or is it in addition to their parameters?

Sharpshooter
This unit possesses Sharpshooters which impede enemy reaction. +1 Initiative bonus in battle to the whole unit.
This ability applies to all elements of the unit that this element is in.

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lodilefty
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Thu Jul 26, 2012 12:14 pm

Captain_Orso wrote:Lt. Infantry regiments with some experience could reach parameter values very comparable with actual sharpshooters regiments. So do sharpshooters get their ability from their parameters, or is it in addition to their parameters?

Sharpshooter
This unit possesses Sharpshooters which impede enemy reaction. +1 Initiative bonus in battle to the whole unit.
This ability applies to all elements of the unit that this element is in.


It's an ability additional to the parameters.....
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stormbringer3
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Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:03 pm

I have never built a Lt. Infantry unit as a reinforcement. How would you use them instead of other unit types?
Thanks.

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Captain_Orso
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Thu Jul 26, 2012 4:14 pm

lodilefty wrote:It's an ability additional to the parameters.....


Thanks Lodi. I kind of thought so, but you never know. And there are a lt. inf. or two with the CS that actually have the ability icon on them, but are still called lt. inf.

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Captain_Orso
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Thu Jul 26, 2012 4:34 pm

stormbringer3 wrote:I have never built a Lt. Infantry unit as a reinforcement. How would you use them instead of other unit types?
Thanks.


Hi stormbringer3,

You can't build theme. The Union gets a bunch of them early in the campaign games in volunteer brigades (2 militia, 1 lt. inf.). The lt. inf. are pretty much like first-line infantry, just a little weaker. The South get a few of these too IIRC, but not nearly as many as the Union. The CS also has a few fat-brigades with lt.inf. in them that also have the skirmisher/sharpshooter ability.

I believe that I read in the forum somewhere that they were the predecessor to the normal 1st-line-infantry. I've always wondered what the exact difference is though; I mean in Real-Life™.

Anyway, I've been using them just like normal infantry brigades. Once I can build divisions and the 2 militia have trained up to 1st line infantry just stick them in. I just thought that if their initiative actually gave them the same affect as actual sharpshooter regiments, they would save some money and effort in having to buy those.

colonel hurst
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Thu Jul 26, 2012 6:29 pm

The CSA can build them beginning in 1863 I believe. They are built in a random southeast state. Their parameters are not that impressive so I usually don't build them.

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Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:02 pm

I remember reading somewhere that light infantry has a decided advantage regarding frontage. I think this is because they are easier to deploy than line infantry, so they take up less space in battle and thus more of them can participate in the battle. I'm not entirely sure how valuable this benefit is, though.

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GraniteStater
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Fri Jul 27, 2012 12:56 am

Yes, the CSA can build them, in the Irregular tab, IIRC.

Light Infantry are good to have in a stack or unit. They are "anti-Cav". AFAIK, they especially reduce the possibilty of your units, in retreat, from being destroyed by enemy pursuit.
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Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:17 am

Gen. Monkey-Bear wrote:I remember reading somewhere that light infantry has a decided advantage regarding frontage. I think this is because they are easier to deploy than line infantry, so they take up less space in battle and thus more of them can participate in the battle. I'm not entirely sure how valuable this benefit is, though.


Check if their movement type is different from others line infantry. If they have a cost per region that is on average 1/4 less that heavy foot, then they are indeed interesting to stuff more on the battlefield.
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lodilefty
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Fri Jul 27, 2012 12:36 pm

Pocus wrote:Check if their movement type is different from others line infantry. If they have a cost per region that is on average 1/4 less that heavy foot, then they are indeed interesting to stuff more on the battlefield.


Sharpshooters and Lt Infantry are $MedFoot movetype at 110%
Inffantry are $HvyFoot at 100%

The two movetypes are not much different in all terrains, except perhaps in some terrains with Mud or Snow give 1 day advantage to MedFoot

$LtFoot does have significant move speed advantage, but is used only for Leaders, Bushwhakers, Partisans, Guerrillas...
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Captain_Orso
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Fri Jul 27, 2012 1:29 pm

yeth mathter, working in it now mathter Image

The "normal" infantry model, which includes conscripts, are sub type: Regular, family: Line, Move Type: HvyFoot, Move Rate: 100.

Light Infantry on the other hand have sub type: Irregular, family: LightInf, Move Type: MedFoot, Move Rate: 110.

To compair

early CSA cavalry has sub type: Cavalry, family: Cavalry, Move Type: MedHorse, Move Rate: 130

late CSA cavalry has sub type: Cavalry, family: Cavalry, Move Type: MedHorse, Move Rate: 120

early USA cavalry has sub type: Cavalry, family: Cavalry, Move Type: MedHorse, Move Rate: 100

late USA cavalry has sub type: Cavalry, family: Cavalry, Move Type: MedHorse, Move Rate: 100

Since I know that even though both the early and late war USA cavalry have a Move Rate of 100 they are still much quicker than infantry, I will assume 2 things:

1) the Move Types have their own factors, Hvy and Light, Foot and Horse, and

2) the Move Rate modifies these

So normal Line infantry build the average marching speed being HvyFoot with Rate 100. LightInf are somewhat quicker with a Rate of 110.

What this doesn't tell us is what the actual difference between Foot and Horse is.

But Pocus as you stated, it also depends on the terrain and since LightInf are Irregular they should have an advantage in rough terrain like forest, mountain and swamp when it comes to frontage.

If and how this plays any role in defending against being pursued I can see no reference from the numbers in the models. The closest that I could guess at would be the sub type Irregular, but that is very speculative.

My summery wold be that LightInf have an advantage in frontage in non-open terrain, but since LightInf only come in brigades with at least 2 other HvyInfantry regiments it would take a lot of effort and coordination to build for example divisions with the largest possible number of LightInf regiments (you might be able to squeeze 4 lt, inf, inf brigades into a division, but at a cost of having too little room for other unit types, so 3 would be the practical max) and put these into a corp for use in rough terrain, but I don't see the Bang-For-The-Buck™ in the effort.

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lodilefty
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Fri Jul 27, 2012 2:07 pm

...but of course Sharpshooters have many of the same advantages, and CAN be purchased separately....

...would be interesting to see behavior of a Division heavily invested with SharpShooters vs. "standard" practice of only 1 per division...
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Longshanks
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Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:21 pm

All I can add is that if you put Jackson (or any other Fast Mover) with a bunch of fast-moving infantry, they move nearly like cavalry, fight well, and take towns when they get there.
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stormbringer3
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Mon Jul 30, 2012 5:39 pm

I'm going to try one of Longshanks light infantry stacks. Would adding horse artillery slow down the light infantry? One is line infantry speed coefficient 110 and the other is medium cavalry speed coefficient 100. However, I don't know how to compare those two stats. Thanks for any help.

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Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:16 pm

It varies, terrain and weather affect it all. In clear weather and clear terrain horse artillery is 80% faster than light infantry.
But in same square, in muddy terrain lt_inf(sharpshooters) with speed coefficient 110 is 10% faster than horse cavalry with 100 speed coefficient.
In marshes, in good weather, lt inf is 46% faster than horse artillery.
There are many combinations.

I wonder, what will be the result of your experiment. You would get a fast moving division, but I presume regular division would beat it of field every time except maybe in rugged terrain in bad weather where frontage greatly matters. Ambush never actually worked for me in AACW, perhaps if you could form an entire division, the result would be different.

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Pocus
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:01 am

By the way the engine supports abilities that are disabled initially and that, with experience, activate. So theoretically it could be feasible to give xp level 3+ light infantries the sharpshooter trait.
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Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:20 am

http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?25067-Gaining-abilities

I'm putting a link to my thread here so hopefully I can get everyone's input and see if we can compile a list of units and generals that can gain or lose abilities.

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