Re: The Civil war From the Southern Viewpoint
Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:30 am
Gray Fox wrote:The first four books you linked are written by founders of the League of the South. This is a white nationalist organization. In their own words:
“Somebody needs to say a good word for slavery. Where in the world are the Negroes better off today than in America?”
— Jack Kershaw, League of the South board member, 1998
“[T]he Southern League supports a return to a political and social system based on kith and kin rather than an impersonal state wedded to the idea of the universal rights of man. At its core is a European population.”
— Michael Hill, essay on League of the South website, 2000
“If the scenario of the South (and the rest of America) being overrun by hordes of non-white immigrants does not appeal to you, then how is this disaster to be averted? By the people who oppose it rising up against their traitorous elite masters and their misanthropic rule. But to do this we must first rid ourselves of the fear of being called ‘racists’ and the other meaningless epithets they use against us. What is really meant by the [anti-racist] advocates when they peg us as ‘racists’ is that we adhere to ethnocentrism, which is a natural affection for one’s own kind. This is both healthy and Biblical. I am not ashamed to say that I prefer my own kind and my own culture. Others can have theirs; I have mine. No group can survive for long if its members do not prefer their own over others.”
— Mike Hill, Web essay
“We also encourage individuals and families to personally secede from the corrupt and corrupting influence of post-Christian culture in America. We call this ‘abjuring the realm,’ and it’s a real and dramatic first step all of us can take by simply withdrawing our support of and allegiance to a regime that has imperiled our future. … Once our Southern culture is re-established, then the political issues will begin to take care of themselves. Good leaders flow naturally out of a healthy culture; however, power-hungry, self-seeking politicians are all we can expect from the debased cultural climate we have today.”
— League website
Appeal to motive- a conclusion is dismissed by simply calling into question the motive of the person or group proposing the conclusion. You’ll often see political organizations use this tactic. “The conclusion of Company X’s positive report on the safety of natural gas fracking can’t be true because they funded the research and have an interest in ensuring there is a positive report.” Sure, Company X may have an interest in getting a positive result for natural gas fracking, but just because they have that motive doesn’t mean the conclusion they reached is necessarily false. Suspect, yes, but not false.
I did not even read much of the quotes but what I think your doing here is trying to dismiss historical truth based on the fact that some of the authors might be of the league of the south. I find it interesting you stopped before the african american author. First I would like you to show me the authors and show they are members. Than show me how the books historical arguments/documents are effected by an authors membership of such a group. I am not asking you to listen to an authors opinion, but facts contained in those books. Than tell me how a radical pro north Marxists/statist book on Lincoln is not bias. Than tell me why we should listen to people like Abraham Lincoln
“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races -- that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I, as much as any other man, am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race.”
-Abraham Lincoln, Lincoln-Douglas Debate Charleston, Illinois
“I agree with Judge Douglas he [African Americans] is not my equal in many respects certainly not in color, perhaps not in moral or intellectual endowment.”
-Abraham Lincoln 1858 Response to Supreme court Dread Scott ruling
“Free them and make them politically and socially our equals? My own feelings will not admit of this . . . . We cannot then make them equals”
-Abraham Lincoln The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln
“I tell him very frankly that I am not in favor of negro citizenship”
“I will to the very last stand by the law of this state[ Illinois], which forbids the marrying of white people with Negroes.”
Gray Fox wrote:As to reading all of those books, I have read quite enough!
In the fifth link, Bennett contends that Lincoln was a racist because he felt freed slaves would not want to live in the country that enslaved them and would therefore want to return to Africa. Fortunately for our country, freed slaves remained here. I got to serve in the U.S. Army with some of the best fighting men this nation ever produced who were descendants of those slaves.
Clearly you have not read bennet book. He makes many arguments from many lines of evidences/quotes to show Lincoln was racists, well because Lincoln was a white supremacists. The fact Lincoln thought freed slaves would not want to live in america has next to nothing to do with his book or Lincolns racists views.
Gray Fox wrote:Everyone in the previous history lived in the ignorance that people of color were a separate race. Science has conclusively proved through Mitochondrial DNA that every human being alive today is descended from a small group of fewer than 10k people. Mount Toba had erupted approximately 75,000 years ago spreading about a meter of ash on most of the world. The population went from several millions to a few thousand as homo sapiens almost went extinct. Those few people lived in Africa. We are one race and we all came out of Africa.
This is a very separate subject but seeing this i am not surprised you accept myths. What you have claimed above is false but on what is related to this topic, the way the bible beat you to it. The south did not view African slaves as an evolutionary separate race, but as wholly mankind created in the image of God. Any ideas otherwise come from post war pro north revisionism. Maybe you could source some "actual scholarly works" Please show me evidence/documents of Southerners believing blacks a lesser evolved animal.
Gray Fox wrote:Soooo...perhaps you have read actual scholarly works on the CW as well? I refer to true historical texts worthy of quoting supported by groups larger than the 9,000 members of the League of the South.
Soooo. maybe realize you believe myths and actual support your position. You did not support any of your claims and they were all false. I will post on Lincoln soon as you seem to want me to. Based on history rather than an authors perceived biases.