One possible Union army

[Gray Fox]

To clarify what I mean by a Union strategy concentrated in the east, here is what can be done if the Union player doesn't split his effort. This is a Union Army that I typically field. I've extended Hooker's 6th Division to show the brigades. The two and single Infantry sub-elements were militia trained up to line infantry. I also expanded French's 39th Artillery Division to show the batteries. The 10-lber is there for counter-battery fire. I prefer 20-lbers, but opted for a cost savings. Finally, Lyon's Corps is offered as a supporting Corps in Grant's Army. The 7th Division is his Artillery Division. Usually Kearney commands a second similar Corps in this Army. Thus I have 13K+ power in one army that can act in synch or MTSG.

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I usually spread a group of entrenched Divisions along the Ohio/Missouri rivers backed up by a reserve stack to hold elsewhere. Then it's hammer time.

[Straight Arrow]

That's a mighty big hammer Gray Fox; don't care to say that I'd like to be the nail.

Around what date would you have this monster ready to roll?

[Gray Fox]

I shoot for the summer of 1862. The Union has about 12 of the brigades that boost cohesion by then. So at least four each of these "boosted" Divisions for Grant, Lyons and Kearney, plus the arty Divisions.

[Cardinal Ape]

That looks to be as about an ideal setup as you can get. Still not good enough for Mac to attack with I'd guess. He says you should wait till '63 for better generals.

Do all of those divisions have late-war cavalry? Where did you get those in mid '62?

[Gray Fox]

I thought that a pic might clarify things, so I took the army I already had at the time in my test game that was already up to '63. So when I started in '62 they were early cavaly.

[minipol]

That's not a hammer, but a sledge hammer. I usually play as the CSA and I can't remember ever having a 5000+ pwr army. Wow.

[Mickey3D]

I can't remember ever having a 5000+ pwr army.

With Lee in command you can expect to have an army (i.e. army stack + corps) of 9000+ pwr somewhere in 1863.

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Gray Fox strategy is calling for an union concentration of force in the East, it does not prevent you to do the same.

What will be difficult is to balance between force dispersal to avoid flanking movement and force regrouping to avoid being overrun.

[pgr]

Couple of questions. First, what is your in game experience with the all arty division inside a corps stack? Does it perform better than having arty in with the line divisions?

Second, just how many guard divisions do you have out west? Why not concentrate them and push in the west too?

[ArmChairGeneral]

My experience with all arty divs inside a corps is that the div concentrates its fire on one unit (division) doing a lot of damage to it before it is in range to fight back. The unit's elements are then quite vulnerable to shaking/routing, which can then cause other elements to make morale checks. I find them highly effective in Corps formations. Spreading the arty in the divisions does not change the total number of artillery hits (as far as I can tell) but the concentration of them on a single unit is very favorable. On top of that, each of my infantry divisions has more combat elements than it would otherwise, making them more effective when toe-to-toe with an enemy division that contains cannons, since the cannons do not fight in the assault phase.

[Gray Fox]

ACG, it's good to see empirical evidence that massed artillery does what it is supposed to do.

I've only ever used artillery loose in the stack or then in a Division after your post about the efficacy of an Artillery Division. Recapping, artillery are support units and get to fill the frontage allocated to those units no matter where they are in the stack. An artillery Division gets the advantages of a Division commander's bonus, which loose guns in the stack would not. Putting them in a Division by themselves leaves more room in the infantry Division for combat elements. They inflict a lot of damage but don't take much return fire, so the Arty commander is on the fast track to promotion. Athena doesn't form large artillery Divisions, so I get the advantage of massed 12 or 20 lbers vs. her mostly mixed Division 6-lbrs. Even if the overall effect was the same, I would do it so that my infantry Divisions had a quarter more slots for infantry.

The "shield" to my Eastern "sword" is a line of entrenched, mostly militia Divisions. I put one each in St. Louis, Cairo, Evansville, Lexington, Cincy, Ashland, Parkersburg, Wheeling and Pittsburgh. The starting force that McDowell commands becomes the reserve for this shield. I have a few stockades block MD off to protect D.C. Then Grant's Army can attack from a position of strength in the summer of 1862.

Every moving unit takes attrition. Even a token offensive force in MO or KY or an amphib assault force as a diversion, takes hits. If I want replacements for my main thrust, then I have to refill all of the depleted units, east and west. It just doesn't work out.

In a couple threads we've discussed the actual importance of the Mississippi river to the Union. Railroads had pretty much totally replaced it as a necessity for Midwest goods. Union ironclads moved captured cotton up the river after delivering reinforcements, but no real economic reason existed for its liberation. Union newspapers might proclaim that the Confederacy was split in two, but TX and AR did not surrender as a consequence. Lee's army did not starve because of the loss of longhorn steaks, but because of the loss of steam engines to pull cargo trains. We all know that taking Ol' Miss was part of the Anaconda Plan and we all equally know that Anaconda was not the plan. The simple fact is that Richmond is worth more than all the other strategic cities combined.

Strategically, VA sticks out like the proverbial sore thumb. The one depot in Garysburg NC connects VA to the rest of the CSA. Even if a second line of depots is constructed (which I would advocate) a force in eastern KY can act against this. Also, partisans can destroy depots all over VA. The peninsula is vulnerable as well as Albemarle sound. A thrust from Williamsburg VA has a dry route to the capital with no rivers to cross. Power numbers don't mean much for me. The elite Union force I have above contains mostly line infantry that the CSA pool does not match. The command effect of Lee and Grant cancel out, but down where the rubber meets the road, good infantry and big guns will make the difference.

[pgr]

Ya, I remember speculating about the ary division... I had a bit of a hiatus from playing, so I haven't really applied it yet! I was just curious about how it actually worked out...and apparently it does well.

As far as the west goes, history discussion aside, you still have a significant force out there, if I'm understanding you correctly. It sounds like you have 9 divisions sitting in cities out there, plus the 4ish divisions that McDowell. That's like 13 or 14 divisions. That's roughly equivalent to your AoP back east right? (6 with Grant and 2 corps of 5 divisions each for 16.) That seems like a lot of investment in what is fairly static shield. Why not just have McDowell in a central location out west with like 6 divisions (in one or two corps) and use the rest of the manpower back east? You could probably get Grant 1 or 2 more corps, and then you are looking at an eastern army with a total power of close to 20K.

[Gray Fox]

Welcome back! I always try to give you credit for the Artillery Division idea.

The shield is a significant force...of Militia Divisions. McDowell's reserve is not much better. Once the CSA faces off with Grant, the shield can bend if it is facing no threat. If nothing is happening in WV, those Divisions can move forward. Same in KY. The point is to create a fortified border that denies the CSA any advantage on that front. I destroy the depots in the west that I don't need and leave depots only in the garrisoned cities. So if the CSA player wants to send Forrest into the midwest, he won't find much to do. Any deliberate offensive will require more effort than the CSA will be able to afford or cost them more than it would be worth.

Here's a pic of one of the militia Divisions:

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It's basically a starting brigade with infantry and one cav element, two of the starting brigades with a light infantry element and two militia, plus a sharpshooter and the rest volunteers from that state. The pic is from an ongoing game, so some of the elements have upgraded over time to line infantry. This is another benefit of the strategy. Build lots of militia early and give them something productive to do until they grow a pair.

[Rod Smart]

What do you do with Mac, Halleck, and Sigel?
Do you have them training up those militia divisions, or at work in the East on the uber-army?

Similar questions with Army HQ- put them with those stacks to give experience, or save the resources for the Eastern Army?

[Gray Fox]

The "training trio" usually set up shop and convert 6 militia to line infantry per turn. These go in the above elite Divisions and then in every new one thereafter. The eastern armies use the HQ units and add experience as the stacks form up. The militia are only with the trio for a turn or two.