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Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:15 am
by Baris
StephenT wrote: For some reason I've never understood, everyone loves Byzantium...


That's for unknown reasons European Union still funding but will bankrupt for the sake of Konstantin nostalgia :-)
But
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syriac_language
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syriac_Orthodox_Church

But depends on which one Byzantium or Syriacs more known or stronger.
http://translate.google.com.tr/translate?hl=tr&sl=tr&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.suryaniler.com%2Fhaber%2Fhaber48.asp

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:20 am
by OneArmedMexican
Franciscus wrote:That's it, for sure !!

AJE = Alea Jacta Est :coeurs:


At first glance this sounds like a great guess. Unfortunately the latin expression is "alea iacta est" with an "i" rather than a "j". "Alea Jacta Est" is a heavy metal album.

Seems we neeed to keep guessing ... or the developpers are really bad at latin. ;)

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:04 am
by Philippe
The "i" versus "j" thing is a bit overstated. It's really just an orthographical convention, and both get used in modern transcriptions.

Using an "i" is more correct than using a "j", but I wouldn't go so far as to say the "j" is incorrect. Most people are more comfortable with the "j", the same way they prefer seeing a "g" rather than a "c".

After all, we write the texts in upper and lower case letters (which they didn't), and don't use weird and incomprehensible abbreviations (which they did).

YMMV, and people are still arguing over what the "Q" in SPQR stood for (it can't be the enclitic "-que" because there's no known instance of that letter standing in for that word in all the thousands of lines of inscriptions that have survived).

A new era for AGEod

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:28 am
by Aphrodite Mae
From my perspective, I just don't see how AJE could be anything other than a Roman antiquity-based game! It's an era for which AGEod hasn't yet released an AGE game; and we're told that the game's scenarios will span vast periods of time. From the dawn of classical antiquity to the middle ages certainly fits the bill, wouldn't you agree? Furthermore, there's the implicit hint that we've been given, of a unifying language, across that gulf of time.

I can't think of anything comparable, with the possible exception of China. (Or Ethiopia. :D )

What else could it be? :)

Whether I'm wrong or right, I just cannot wait for the game, whatever it is! What PT has told us about the game reveals a totally new direction for AGEod, and the implications are just breath-taking!

Consider how PoN is AGEod's most complex game, to date. It took years to develop. (Unless I'm mistaken, its development began in 2007.) This new approach will enable a progressive layering and refinement of AJE that may someday make PoN pale, in comparison... even in all of its richness, depth, and beauty. And yet, we'll be playing it while it's growing into something with a scope and depth unseen in AGEod games, before. Best of all, perhaps, it will all be done with the historical accuracy for which AGEod is renowned. :)

One of the many things which makes AGEod distinctive is the interaction between the company and the public. The company releases a great new game, and then that game is progressively refined by its fans through patches and mods. Those fans who volunteer to help tend to be people who love the game, have expertise in it, and have great ideas of how to make it even better. The company rewards this loyalty with unparalleled support. It is a graceful dance that we do, and its form is both elegant and beautiful. The results speak for themselves. :)

That is why I deeply believe that if this game succeeds, if it is well received, then our unique, productive, artistic synergy of "AGEod and us" will create something that will be truly epic: a fine-tuned, historically correct epochal game of great depth and artistic beauty that is unlike anything in the history of wargames.

Wow.
Thanks, AGEod! :)

[SIZE="3"][font="Book Antiqua"]Aphrodite Mae[/font][/size]

PS "Thanks", unless it's about a thousand years of nothing-but-Ethiopian carnage, OK? :D

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:02 am
by Ilitarist
StephenT wrote:For some reason I've never understood, everyone loves Byzantium...


I can't understand this too. For orthodox like me it's a second Rome and symbol of power of the true faith. But what is it for you, western heretics? Mystery.

Let's also hope the game has tutorials and explanations. I still don't understand how to combine troops in AGE games.

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:00 am
by Narwhal
Byzantium is antique Rome in the Medieval Age.

Of course, Byzantium did ot work like the Imperial Empire, but it is the only state in Europe that survived Antiquity until the Medieval age, and &ctually for quite a long time the only "State", when the rest of Europe were chiefdoms.

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:00 am
by Florent
Let's also hope the game has tutorials and explanations. I still don't understand how to combine troops in AGE games.

Since BoA, AGEOD has ALWAYS done Tutorials.
Just take the time to do them ;) especially if you aren't sure of your knowledge, i have done them again in RuS.

I simply don't understand why/how some players said " It's too complicate for me, etc...

You have just a few buttons, did you try Falcon 4, Dangerous Waters, Silent Hunters Serie or many other games with dozens of buttons. :bonk:

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:03 am
by Narwhal
Florent wrote:Let's also hope the game has tutorials and explanations. I still don't understand how to combine troops in AGE games.

Since BoA, AGEOD has ALWAYS done Tutorials.
Just take the time to do them ;) especially if you aren't sure of your knowledge, i have done them again in RuS.


Mostly because there are a great number of items in AGEOD games that are neither covered in the tutorial or in the manual. For instance, what are Depot BTN for in RoP ? It is not in the manual, and it is not in the tutorial. And it is essential.

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:04 am
by Florent
Byzantium is antique Rome in the Medieval Age.

Actually there is some interesting campaign with Belisarius during the reconquest against a varity of ennemies. (in the 550s(

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:08 am
by Florent
The Depot Btn were added lately and manual wasn't updated but this is not a major problem for the player.

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:24 am
by Franciscus
StephenT wrote:For some reason I've never understood, everyone loves Byzantium...


To me, it's the childish lure of the "lost cause" (like in the ACW), and "what-ifs", specially:
- what-if Justinian had achieved the stable reconquest of the western empire ?
- what-if the eastern romans or the persians had destroyed the rising muslims ?
- what-if the 4th crusade didn't happen ?
- what-if Byzantium fall could be prevented with the help of the west (as Vienna fall was prevented) ?

And no, no political discussions are intended or will be done by me :)

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 11:03 am
by Baris
Ilitarist wrote:I can't understand this too. For orthodox like me it's a second Rome and symbol of power of the true faith. But what is it for you, western heretics? Mystery.



Jealous Western heretics also helped Seljuk(early Ottoman Turks) conquer Konstantinople. But in truth Konstantinople patriarch politically was very much ignored after city captured. Rus tried to control all orthodox patriarchy.
2nd Rome(If that is wanted to be called Byzantium) did the same thing to Syriacs. In Tv there was an old peasant women living in Mardin was still talking with Syriacs language dialect. Incredible!

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 11:08 am
by wosung
OneArmedMexican wrote:At first glance this sounds like a great guess. Unfortunately the latin expression is "alea iacta est" with an "i" rather than a "j". "Alea Jacta Est" is a heavy metal album.

Seems we neeed to keep guessing ... or the developpers are really bad at latin. ;)


Different spelling of Latin in English (plus German) and French (plus other Romanic languages):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alea_iacta_est
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alea_jacta_est

That heavy metal album was made by a Spanish band from Asturia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alea_Jacta_Est

Regards

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:10 pm
by Ilitarist
Florent wrote:Since BoA, AGEOD has ALWAYS done Tutorials.
Just take the time to do them ;) especially if you aren't sure of your knowledge, i have done them again in RuS.

I simply don't understand why/how some players said " It's too complicate for me, etc...


Those tutorials are useless. They teach me obvious things (moving armies, combining troops) with plain text, but they don't tell anything that isn't obvious. What and how affects battles? How do I supply armies? What army composition should I use in specific situations? It's very hard to guess from the game itself and I have to read manual to know such trivial things.

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:46 pm
by lodilefty
Ilitarist wrote:Those tutorials are useless. They teach me obvious things (moving armies, combining troops) with plain text, but they don't tell anything that isn't obvious. What and how affects battles? How do I supply armies? What army composition should I use in specific situations? It's very hard to guess from the game itself and I have to read manual to know such trivial things.


...and so you come here and we answer your questions! :w00t:

If the games were not still evolving [AACW was published in 2007], it might make sense to dedicate scarce resources to manual updates, but IMHO, the forum and the Wikis server as a much better, 21st Century way to find help.

WIA Manual is on-line at Wiki, and so is AACW Manual. We try to keep them relevant.

I'd rather spend my time upgrading and patching old games and help developing new games.

I hope that's what folks want, lest I need to reevaluate my hobby and find another.

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:53 pm
by ERISS
lodilefty wrote:I'd rather spend my time upgrading and patching old games and help developing new games.

Tutorial is part of the game.
I did change the RUS tutorial texts (with my translations in French, and then in English integered in past year patch) to make it a little usefull (before it was irritating as it was destroying the beginning understanding of the game). Even now, some irritating big errors are still unbelivably ingame http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=24287 (but maybe it is for AGE is a sect with its believers and distorded minds?).
AGE games are not fair as they don't warn they don't play well in big dpi and they don't say internet is required to understand the game (read the good manual).

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:13 pm
by Baris
Image

A challenge to PON. 400 years !
Starting with 1071 Battle of Manzikert with big army of Romanus IV Diogenes mostly with mercenaries. Result of the battle is the forming anatolian beyliks. If the new game follow the time frame of Crusader kings 2. :D

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 11:37 pm
by Philippe
Franciscus wrote:To me, it's the childish lure of the "lost cause" (like in the ACW), and "what-ifs", specially:
- what-if Justinian had achieved the stable reconquest of the western empire ?
- what-if the eastern romans or the persians had destroyed the rising muslims ?
- what-if the 4th crusade didn't happen ?
- what-if Byzantium fall could be prevented with the help of the west (as Vienna fall was prevented) ?

And no, no political discussions are intended or will be done by me :)



It should be pointed out that the "lost cause" in question managed to stay in business for the better part of a thousand years. That's an awful lot of declining and falling, and one has to conclude that they must have been really good at it.

When the longevity of a lost cause looks like several multiples of what you would expect from a successful nation, perhaps it's time to re-examine the concept of what a lost cause really is.

Dismissing Byzantium as merely Rome in decline gives rise to a lot of stereotypes that are probably inappropriate.

In real life (tm) you don't get victory points for spreading all over the world map. That's probably one of the reasons it doesn't happen very often.

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 12:12 am
by Franciscus
Philippe wrote:It should be pointed out that the "lost cause" in question managed to stay in business for the better part of a thousand years. That's an awful lot of declining and falling, and one has to conclude that they must have been really good at it.

When the longevity of a lost cause looks like several multiples of what you would expect from a successful nation, perhaps it's time to re-examine the concept of what a lost cause really is.

Dismissing Byzantium as merely Rome in decline gives rise to a lot of stereotypes that are probably inappropriate.

In real life (tm) you don't get victory points for spreading all over the world map. That's probably one of the reasons it doesn't happen very often.


My dear Philippe: you forgot the "childish" part of my post :D

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 12:16 am
by Baris
2nd Rome advanced bureaucracy can be/was much better then rest of Europe states but I don't see alternative scenario when great tribal migration from steppes towards anatolia did left a single chance even a stone unharmed. There is some papacy sources of course. Some professors mentions some parts hidden still.?!
But I think biggest stereotype was roman dynasty and tradition ended with the fall of Constantinople. It should be mentioned that the first Rome were superstructure independent of religion.

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 5:49 pm
by Philippe
Franciscus wrote:My dear Philippe: you forgot the "childish" part of my post :D



I guess that at the end of the day I don't really think of over-attachment to lost causes as being childish. Unrealistically romantic, perhaps, but not childish.

I will be the first to admit to being a sucker for lost causes. But part of my interest in Byzantium may have to do with watching the role of 21rst century America on the world stage and wondering if it doesn't have more in common with Byzantium than imperial Rome.

The theology is another kettle of fish. Byzantine theology was subtle, often involved peculiarities and distinctions only comprehensible in ancient Greek, and (for an uncivilized westerner) headache-inducing and entirely without parallel in the modern world. And, mercifully, we'll never see anything that really resembles Caesaropapism.

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:52 pm
by Baris
If theology not important then why the romanticism thousands Km away. transition was from wine and bread to Rakı and fish(That is also called Uzo) :-)

Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:37 pm
by tagwyn
Havely: It will never rival your beauty! L3

Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:58 pm
by JMass
Give me the Romaion Empire and I'll be the happier wargamer! :thumbsup: :coeurs:

Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:11 am
by Florent
Ok, it is almost the End of March, thus we will have the confirmation of what the game subject is soon :thumbsup:

Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:25 am
by Hohenlohe
Florent wrote:Ok, it is almost the End of March, thus we will have the confirmation of what the game subject is soon :thumbsup:


I'll hope that....

greetings

Hohenlohe

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:33 am
by Florent
Will the game have the multi-choice Event allowing the players to get historical special reinforcement event or so like RoP or RuS ?

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:44 pm
by Pocus
According to the sneak (and privileged) peaks I got onto the project (project made by the S.A.S team, i.e St├ęphane And St├ęphane :) ), you get both reinforcements with drag&drop interface, plus historical options for these extra, special units.

New Game!

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:23 pm
by Knight of the Realm
Ditto for me! Looking forward to finding out what it will be! And when it will be released!

Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:23 pm
by Florent
Thanks Pocus, any information of the scale of an area, 20-25 km like RoP or more like NCP ?