On French Intervention

[malthaussen]

The Colonists have never won a battle. 11 of 13 objectives are in British hands, only Philadelphia and Pittsburgh remaining to the Colonists. 18 of 25 objective towns are also in British hands. The British have 925 VPs, the Americans 425. And the British have inflicted 13,867 losses on the Americans, while losing only 3217 men of their own.

Despite this, France allies with America in February of 1778. I find this an extremely improbable result. If the French are going to intervene despite anything the British do, then there is no point in screwing around with a diplomatic system at all.

-- Mal

[lodilefty]

WAD

Improbable, but not impossible, as long as the USA holds onto some objectives and strategic cities.

Game Design (and it's essentially same since the BoA hame was published):

Two stages to the French:

As soon as the Foreign Entry somehow reaches 100 {on standard setting} recognition occurs (Franklin has huge effect on this), reported to players as the French Alliance. Then the calculations start on further Intervention, aka French Entry (troops).....

Total control of all objectives and Strategic Cities in a Theater (New England, Middle States, Middle South, Deep South) is the differential, reducing probabilities of Intervention.

Also, if at the start of 1782, USA National Morale i greater than British Morale, French Intervention will still ocuur.

Historically, the French really wanted to get back at Britain for the 7 years war....

[PhilThib]

Well, don't forget the French were after a revenge from the 7YW defeat, and thus an opportunity to strike at the British was always looked after... You could plausibly envision that despite (or because of) military success in the New World, Britain has weakened her defenses elsewhere (Europe, India) and it makes a good opportunity for the French

[AEWHistory]

When I teach about the Seven Years' War (SYW) and the following period there are a few key points that I am always key to make and one of them is the eagerness of the French to seek revenge for the colonial defeat in the SYW. Keep in mind that there was absolutely nothing about the American Revolution--ideologically--that appealed to the French monarchy. Yes, there were liberal French aristocrats that found American Revolutionary ideas quite appealing, but the monarchy was extremely conservative. This would seem to make the Americans and French unlikely allies except for the growing British commercial dominance and their military victory in the SYW. Consequently, the French involvement in the SYW was not about ideology, and not really about sympathy with the American cause at all; it was about sticking it to the British.... and THAT was a cause for which many French could become quite excited about across a broad political spectrum. And they got what they wanted, albeit at a high price. So I think that it is a fair interpretation to say that French involvement is more likely than not. Possibly the game weights it too much toward involvement, I cannot say as I've not played enough, but so far my experience is not at odds with what I would say is historically accurate. Of course, whenever anyone's game moves away from what really happened into the 'what if' then the model becomes much more subjective and interpretive.

[Durk]

I shared your same frustration in my early games. However, as lodilefty relates, there are several variations, most of which lead to eventual French intervention. If I am doing well as the Americans, I hold back on the intervention options. As the British, I plug every option and can typically get a one year delay. Which really helps.