Omnius
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1813 Napoleon Shown the Eagles Snafu?

Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:34 pm

Bohemond,
I'm not sure what's up but when I tried to use the Napoleon is Shown the Eagles Military Option I just couldn't seem to get it to work after many attempts. I used it with success in another scenario so am puzzled. I tried it with Napoleon not with the Guard corps and it didn't work so I moved the Guard to Nappy in Dresden and tried with no success. There was an Austrian unit in an adjacent region, Most, and maybe that messed me up.

Then I moved Nappy and the Guard, both infantry and cavalry, to Cottbus and once again tried to show Nappy the eagles with no success. Might have been because some battles were raging in regions adjacent. So later on I took Prag with Nappy and both Guard corps in tow. I tried twice to show Nappy the Eagles at Prag, once while building a depot and chasing away an adjacent Austrian unit and once with no adjacent enemy units and the depot built at Prag.

I can't remember how I managed to successfully show Nappy the eagles in the 1815 scenario but it seemed simple. I don't think I had put the Guards into Nappy's army formation.

Can you check out that Military Option to ensure that it is properly scripted? It seems like in the 1815 scenario it works really nice but something is preventing it from working easily in 1813. I'm going to test it out further by turning off the AI and seeing if I can get Nappy and the Guards in Dresden while moving off that adjacent Austrian unit to see if I can make it work finally and what I have to do to make it work.

Omnius
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Can't Show Napoleon the Eagles Still

Fri Jan 21, 2011 5:08 pm

Bohemond or Pocus,
Okay I just finished my test of turning off the AI and playing the 1813 scenario to see if I could get the show Napoleon the eagles military option working. I moved away the Austrian unit adjacent to Dresden and built a depot at Dresden while moving the two Guards corps to Dresden. I tried to show Nappy the eagles from turn two forward and after 6 turns of trying I just couldn't get that military option to work. I even tried putting Mortier's and Nansouty's corps inside the Grand Armee with Nappy and that didn't do the trick twice in a row. I was very careful to ensure I checked the option each turn.

It sure seems like this military option is broken in 1813 but it does work in the 1815 scenario Bohemond posted on the forum to show militia being used as garrisons in France. In the 1815 scenario the show Nappy the eagles option worked just fine and I don't remember having to do anything fancy to make it work. In the 1815 scenario I got the +10 NM boost and Nappy was not active the following turn just as the option describes will happen.

I sure hope this military option can be made to work in the 1813 scenario as I'm sure this failure frustrated many players playing the French.

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Pocus
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Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:32 pm

Omnius wrote:Pocus,
Yep making a really good AI is the wargame programmer's Holy Grail and so far no one has mastered it. Someday I'd like to be able to turn an AI on to a harder level where it actually plays smarter rather than just having a lot more stuff to throw at us. The AI difficulty buttons always remind me of the old George Carlin joke about the tv brightness button - "I turn the bright button up all the way but the tv never gets any smarter". :wacko:

I'm really glad to hear that you may be able to put some time into improving the AGE engine AI. I know that with a series of games that things improve with each game in that series. Will your AI improvements get into NCP or BoA as well? :cool:

Is there a place where I can get my hands on some kind of manual about the AGE engine scripting language? I'm starting to think that I should learn it since I really like the AGE engine series, despite my complaints, and it would behoove me to learn the scripting language so I can mod scenarios.

Yes I believe most of the AI improvements can make into the older games, no problem.

Have you tried, in addition to the modding forum, the wiki?
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Bohémond
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RE ; 1813 Napoleon Shown the Eagles Snafu?

Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:47 am

Omnius,

Tahnk you for reporting

Could you please make a backup of ScriptReport ( located in NCP\Scripts) wehn you find this kind of issue ? And then post it in the forum ?

It makes often the finding of issue easier.

About the event display problem in 1813 Scenario, can you specify the filename or post or ScreenShot ?

Regards

Bohémond

Omnius
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More Specific

Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:36 pm

Bohemond,
I forgot to put in some of the filename but thankfully I remember that the filename ended with "Ried1813b". I hope that helps you track down that 1813 event that shows the filename instead of the event even though it does show the text.

I'll have to try to remember that scriptreport file next time I see an event problem so I can make it easier to track down event bugs.

Pocus,
Can you shed a little more light on where to go at Wiki or what to search for to find an AGE engine scripting manual or info? I'm glad you're going to retrofit AI improvements into older games giving them new life. :thumbsup:

Omnius
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Showing Napoleon the Eagles

Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:52 pm

Pocus,
Any ideas about why I can't get the military option of showing Napoleon the Eagles to work in the 1813 scenario but it worked just fine for me in the 1815 scenario? I tried a whole bunch of times in a game and in a test game and just couldn't get that option to work in 1813 when it seemed effortless in my 1815 game. Does Nappy have to be inside a structure for it to work?

Omnius
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Depot Capture Event Snafu

Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:42 pm

Bohemond,
I was playing the 1812 scenario and discovered an anomaly with how captured depots get reported. I've noticed that the side losing the depot always gets told the depot got captured. However on the capturing side if the depot was destroyed I see that message come across as the citizens destroying the depot before fleeing. Shouldn't both sides get the same depot capture message? I always check to look at the city to see if the depot is still there or not with the mouse tooltip feature.

I remember seeing an 1812 AAR where the guy who wrote it using an earlier version was all happy he captured every major Russian depot as the French along with tons of supplies. I like this version better where Pocus or someone put the Scorched back into the Scorched Earth policy. Now seeing the Scorched Earth policy event message from the French perspective doesn't make me laugh. It makes NCP model well how the war was a kinder variety in the early years while progressing towards a more vicious style in later years.

Oh and shouldn't the Russian player see the Scorched Earth message too?

Lots of one sided messages that I think should be seen by both players like the Turkey Peace Treaty one that only the Russian sees which boosts up his NM. Shouldn't the French player see it as well so he knows why the Russian NM got pumped up? :blink:

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Pocus
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Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:12 pm

I'll check the Show the Eagles, give me a few days.

Yes, messages can surely be broadcasted more, indeed.
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Omnius
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Show Me the Eagles!

Tue Jan 25, 2011 4:26 pm

Pocus,
Thanks for taking a look at the 1813 scenario where I couldn't get the military option of Showing Napoleon the Eagles to work but could in the 1815 scenario. As I recall I couldn't do the trick in 1815 in the field, I had to be in a city/depot for it to work. I also saw that the AI didn't use the option in 1813.

Omnius
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These Aren't the Guns We're Looking For

Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:19 pm

Pocus,
I was playing the 1807 short Polish scenario and when I ordered up the Guns Replacements as the Russian player I got French guns instead of Russian ones. Makes that military option useless for the Russian player though I guess I'll have to try to see if they'll be absorbed regardless of the guns replacements being the wrong nationality. I sure hope this military option gets fixed as it tends to be rather important.

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Bohémond
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Mon Feb 07, 2011 1:54 am

Omnius,

Try attached zip file, it should solve the wrong Arty replacements for Russian.

Unzip and copy in NCP\Events.

There are some others issues in automatic Replacements and Supply by events ( not options) for this scenario. I will try to find some time to fix them.

Regards

Bohémond
Attachments
HistOptions07.zip
(1.6 KiB) Downloaded 100 times

Omnius
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Replacement Fix

Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:23 pm

Bohemond,
I'll give your 1807 scenario file a play to see if the Russian Guns Replacements military option works properly. I saw the poor Russian AI bought two batches of guns replacements and they just sat there unused. Sad that this obvious booboo was never fixed before. Thanks for paying attention to the problems I'm reporting as I play through each scenario. :D

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Bohémond
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Re Replacement fix

Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:57 pm

Omnius,

You are welcome, fixing such issue is not very time consuming.
What takes a lot of time is testing, reporting and posting fixes xls files with a readme file as clear as possible.

Regards

Bohémond

Omnius
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Works Great

Tue Feb 08, 2011 4:40 pm

Bohemond,
I kind of figured that once you knew of the problem with the mixed up guns replacements that making the actual fix wasn't that big a deal. However it's the documentation that's a time killer. :bonk: I tried out your event fix and the Russian guns came in right nicely for the short 1807 Polish scenario.

Maybe we can team up to work on fixing the scenarios after getting this patch out. You have the scripting commands down pat and I can test out your handiwork as well as give ideas on how to fix things that don't seem quite right. Kind of like how NASA and ESA work together in international cooperation! :thumbsup:

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Bohémond
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Wed Feb 09, 2011 4:34 pm

Omnius,

Any feedback and report is welcome and your testing can save a lot of time for me.

I'm focusing, for now, on Prussian Campaign Scenario so let me know if you see some issues with it.

Regards

Bohémond

Omnius
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1808 Swedish Scenario Event Bug

Wed Feb 09, 2011 5:57 pm

Bohemond,
I found an event problem in the 1808 Swedish-Russian war scenario. On the Swedish side there's an event named "event_nam_EnemyinFinland1809" where the event filename shows up instead of the text. However the event seems to work properly as Swedish guerilla units pop up and clicking on the event takes you to them. Just need to fix it so the proper file text shows up instead of the filename.

I've been trying to work my way through all of the scenarios to see how they fare. I've just finished playing the Swedes in the 1808 Swedish-Russian war and am going to give the Russians a go. I was planning on playing the Spanish Ulcer campaign but figure that it will give me an ulcer playing it considering all the complaints about this overly long scenario.

Let me finish up that one scenario and then I'll go back to playing the 1806-1807 long Prussian scenario. I take it that's the one you're working on right now correct? Now that I've gone through each scenario playing against the AI I'm going back and turning off the AI to play each one solo hotseat so that I'll see what's right or wrong with each side.

Omnius
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Two Event Messages

Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:02 pm

Bohemond,
In regards to my last post about the problem with the EnemyinFinland event not showing the proper text I think there are two such events. I did get guerillas in 1808 but the text showed properly telling me I got them. It was late in the game, turn 69, in 1809 where I got guerillas but the event text didn't show properly, just the filename. So don't get fooled if you happen across an EnemyinFinland1808 event that does look properly scripted, look further on for the EnemyinFinland1809 event that needs to be corrected to show text instead of filename.

Omnius
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Show Me the Eagles 1813

Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:33 pm

I tried looking at the xls files and other files to see if I could spot and fix the 1813 problem with the military option of Show Napoleon the Eagles. I did test out that I could get that military option to work in the 1815 scenario regardless of whether Napoleon was on a depot or not but there was no way I could make it work in the 1813 scenario.

I did notice that in the 1815 scenario file that "EvalUnqUnit = Napoleon Bonaparte" while in 1813 it's "EvalUnqUnit = Napoleon". I changed that in the HistOptions13 file in the Events folder but it didn't seem to do anything after starting a new game.

I also noticed that in the HistOptions13 file that at the beginning of the scripting for the military option event that both 1815 and 1813 show Milano as the SelectRegion. In 1815 Milano is Austrian controlled and units can not enter. In 1813 Milano is Kingdom of Italy controlled and units can enter. I tried changing the SelectRegion to Ofen (and all other places where region is mentioned) since it's Austrian controlled in 1813 and units can not enter. That also didn't work as I tried to create a new game after the change.

I'm not sure if I should have tried the F9 key to bring up the Game Editor to see if there would be a new rendition of the 1813 scenario to save after making changes directly in the HistOption13 file. I even tried opening both 1813 and 1815 HistOption files and then use the old astronomer "blink" method of switching synchronized pages to spot changes. Looked like everything was pretty much the same except for the two differences I mentioned earlier and the proper changes in the faction ID.

I'm sure Pocus's trained eye is better at spotting scripting booboo's than my untrained eyes but I hope that maybe I can give Pocus some ideas as to what's wrong so he can fix it for the next patch.

Omnius
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Not the Bug I was Looking For

Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:15 pm

Well I finally was able to test out my theory about whether the naming of Napoleon was the problem and discovered that it isn't the problem not allowing the military option of showing Napoleon the Eagles to work properly. On the bright side I was gratified that my first attempt to make a modding correction in the xls files and then use CSVSplitter and the Edit Mode to make a new scenario file was a success. :thumbsup: Afterwards I looked at how Napoleon was named in the main scenario xls file and in 1813 he's named Napoleon. Then looked at the units file and saw there are 5 flavors of Napoleon in the database.

Well back to the drawing board to see if I can find the error that prevents the show Napoleon the eagles military option to not work in 1813 though it works great in 1815.

Omnius
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SelectRegion = Why Milano?

Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:05 pm

In my endeavor to fix the 1813 Show Napoleon the Eagles military option I've been going over both sets of xls spreadsheets that concern the HistOptions file. I've looked over every line of scripting for both files and everything appears the same except for the EvalUnqUnit line where in 1813 it's Napoleon but in 1815 it's Napoleon Bonaparte. After looking over the main scenario spreadsheets I see that Napoleon is defined differently for both scenarios and the EvalUnqUnit labels for Napoleon are consistent for the two scenarios.

I'm down to the SelectRegion command where both sets of files list Milano as the SelectRegion parameter. I looked at the AGEWiki page for the SelectRegion command and am wondering why Milano? In 1815 Milano is Austrian controlled and units can't enter while in 1813 Milano is Kingdom of Italy controlled and units can enter. In 1815 Austria is inactive while in 1813 the Kingdom of Italy is active.

My burning question is why Milano was chosen as the selectRegion for this military option event for both scenarios? What attribute is the program looking for to consider this region valid or not? I saw in the AGEWiki that the program looks for whether an enemy unit is in the region but that doesn't seem to be the case for either 1813 or 1815.

I keep wondering if another region might be more appropriate for 1813 than Milano. Would Madrid be more appropriate for 1813 since Spain is inactive and units can't enter Madrid?

Omnius
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1814 Eagle Event Not Working

Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:14 pm

I tried changing the SelectRegion in the 1813 HistOptions file to Madrid but it didn't help make the military option of Showing Napoleon the Eagles work as I had hoped.

Then I checked out the 1814 Battle for France scenario and found that it too has the military option event for showing Napoleon the Eagles. It too does not work just like in the 1813 scenario. Even the AI can't trigger the event in either scenario and the one precondition of having NM <=100 for the AI is met in both as French NM starts at 90 in 1813 and 80 in 1814.

I'm beginning to suspect the problem is the SelectRegion used. In the 1815 scenario I can show Napoelon the Eagles with ease and regularity but never does it work in the 1813 and 1814 scenarios. In the 1815 scenario Milano is inactive while in the 1813 and 1814 scenarios Milano is active.

My problem boils down to what criteria does the SelectRegion have to have in order for it to work properly with the military option event of showing Napoleon the Eagles? If indeed this is the problem that stops the event from working properly in 1813 and 1814 then which region would make these malfunctioning events work?

I sure hope that Pocus can figure this problem out and get the option working for the 1813 and 1814 scenarios for the next patch. The solution is definitely beyond my paygrade. :(

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Bohémond
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Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:40 am

Hello,

Milano in HistOption15 is part of the StartEvent SriptCommand, it's the region parameter (Alias for the region where the event occurs or NULL. Use NULL if you do a conditional region selection in the event. The message generated by the event will "jump" the map view to this location.). Changing this parameter will not make this event working properly.

I will suggest you to use the SelectSubUnit instead of the EvalUnqUnit ScriptCommand. The unit name can change the models never do.

Try with SelectSubUnits = Models $ldr_FRA_Napoleon4Old for the 1815 Scenario. Should not work for other scenario as there 5 Napoleon units and 5 Napoleon models.

Let me know if it works, if not I will investigate more.

Regards

Bohémond

Omnius
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Being Clear

Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:51 pm

Bohemond,
Thanks for suggestions regarding making the military option of showing Napoleon the Eagles work. The problem is that the 1815 scenario has a working option for showing Napoleon the eagles while the 1813 and 1814 scenarios do not. The EvalUnqUnit command does work in the 1815 file so that's not the solution to switch to SelectSubUnit. The Napoleon unit names in all 3 scenario HistOptions files are consistent with their main scenario files where they are named.

After seeing that both 1813 and 1814 don't work I saw a correlation in that Milano is not active in 1815 yet that scenario works. In both 1813 and 1814 Milano is active and the option for showing Napoleon the Eagles doesn't work. I see where some events have the SelectRegion used and some don't. In the 1815 scenario the map doesn't jump to Milano when the event is used.

I've wasted way too many hours trying to figure out the problem with 1813 and 1814 scenarios having a failed military option of showing Napoleon the Eagles. I'm hoping that Pocus will find the time to look at the problem and fix it as he understands the scripting far better than I do. :cool:

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Pocus
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Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:41 am

I'm trying to scrap some hours for the games already released, but so far, no luck. I don't forget you, if this can be of any reassurance to you though...
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Hofstadter's Law: "It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's law."

Omnius
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Waiting Patiently

Sat Feb 26, 2011 4:05 pm

Pocus,
Thanks for keeping tabs on this thread and keeping the event snafu showing Napoleon the Eagles in mind despite your heavy workload. I was hoping I could help you out by solving this mystery myself but I'm just not savvy enough with the scripting yet to know where that error is. Unfortunately it's not a simple typo that I could spot and fix. I'm still scratching my head about the SelectRegion of Milano since there seems to be a correlation between it being inactive in the 1815 scenario where the event works and it being active in the 1813 and 1814 scenarios where the event doesn't work.

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Pocus
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Sun Mar 13, 2011 10:47 am

The thing is that the search was not done on the proper name, with EvalUnqUnit (which is a pretty rancid command, but was ok-ish in 2008)

I replaced the EvalUnqUnit = Napoleon by

StartEvent = evt_nam_FRA_MilitaryOption_MOR_Check|999|0|NULL|NULL|NULL|NULL

Conditions
CheckOption = $gmaOptionMil;FRA_MilitaryOption_MOR;=;1
SelectSubUnits = Models $ldr_FRA_Napoleon4Old $ldr_FRA_Napoleon4 $ldr_FRA_Napoleon3
EvalSubUnitSel


In both scenarios and it should be ok.
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Hofstadter's Law: "It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's law."

Omnius
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Show Me the Eagles!

Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:58 pm

Pocus,
So it was the EvalUnqUnit command after all that was the problem. I can't wait to see how the new fix works in 1813 and 1814 as having that military option available for the French side will be a real help. Hopefully the working 1815 scenario will still work. Thanks so much for taking some time away from your very busy schedule to figure out this connundrum! :thumbsup:

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