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Bernadotte
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Sat Dec 18, 2010 12:36 pm

Sorry to be spiteful, but was NCP ever alpha or beta tested ??? :(

Thanks anyway for a great game with lots of potential.
And thanks for the constant support Ageod and of course your labour Bohémond !

Regards,
Bernadotte

Omnius
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Industry Wide Problem

Sat Dec 18, 2010 4:01 pm

Bernadotte,
Actually the bad beta testing is an industry-wide problem because there's now too much pressure to release games long before they're ready for prime time. Back in the old days when we could buy these games in stores the pressure to release a game on a certain date was magnified because shelf space was reserved for a game and it cost companies too much money to lose that reserved shelf space.

Part of the problem are the new software distribution giants like Matrix and Paradox who push for games to be released prematurely, all for the sake of raking in those sales dollars as soon as possible.

Beta testers are also part of the problem now with games that can be modded. Instead of focusing on beta testing the standard version too many beta testers get carried away with modding to actually beta test. On the plus side atleast we get some beta testers who mod who then know how to fix the myriad number of mistakes still left in the legacy version, like Bohemond is currently doing.

My solution is patience, I wait for games to be more fully finished before buying. I wait for the legacy patch to be released before buying, that way I'm sure to get a fairly decently finished product to enjoy with most of the annoying bugs already fixed. I just bought NCP and am glad that one more patch is being worked on as that will mean an even better gaming experience once it's official and finished. :cool:

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Bernadotte
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Location: south of munich (germany)

Sun Dec 19, 2010 4:34 pm

@Bohémond
Sorry for hijacking your thread

@Omnius
I understand the reasons you mentioned, but ageod games are not easy to manage and when there are so many bugs and oddities it's even harder !
I have no understanding when the obvious bugs are not fixed, even after the 6th patch.

Anyway I stop complaining now and better keep on fighting the "red coats". :D

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Bohémond
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Mon Dec 20, 2010 4:27 am

Issue C5 ; Models

Models NED_80SOL (ID 1193), NED_74SOL (ID 1194), NED_64SOL (ID 1195), NED_44Frg (ID 1196) and NED_Frg (ID 1197) have ;

wrong Text Parameter ($mdl_txt_DEN_XXXX) should be $mdl_txt_NED_XXXX , very minor issue as this parameter is not used in NCP.

wrong Color Parameter ($colDENNavy) should be $colNEDNavy.


Revised files to be included in next NCP Database Release.

Regards

Bohémond

Omnius
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Internet Also the Problem

Mon Dec 20, 2010 3:58 pm

Bernadotte,
It's not just AGEOD games but the whole industry which has problems with quality control. Back in the good old daze before the internet companies had to put out games which were pretty much finished products because the alternative for sending out patches was to mail them via snail mail, that became an expensive cost which forced longer development time. Along came the internet and then the game companies got slack with their development because they could cheaply do patches and provide them via a download option.

Not to mention over time the games have become far more complex to program with so many bells and whistles. As customers we just have to live with the hand we've been dealt, that's why I wait until I see a game pretty much done with a legacy patch. I'm just thankful that AGEOD decided to clean up unfinished business with some of these legacy games so that their products are even better than ever. :)

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Bohémond
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Tue Dec 21, 2010 4:05 am

Issued B2 ; Units

Units NED_Brg0 (ID 1321), NED_Tra0 (ID 1322) have wrong Color Parameter ($colAusNavy) should be $colNEDNavy.


Revised files to be included in next NCP Database Issues Release.

Regards

Bohémond

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Bohémond
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Wed Dec 22, 2010 4:13 am

Hello,

Please find enclose ;

NCP Database RevC rar file ; Compiled file in folder Structure
NCP Database xls RevC Zip file ; Revised units, models and LocalStrings_NCP xls file
Readme NCP Database RevC text file ; Change log list

Database RevA files included.
NCP Database modfications thread improvement included;

Regards

Bohémond
Attachments

[The extension txt has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

NCPDatabaseRevC.rar
(4.1 MiB) Downloaded 123 times
NCPDatabase xls RevC.zip
(2.51 MiB) Downloaded 105 times

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PhilThib
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Wed Dec 22, 2010 8:45 am

In other words it includes (and replaces) all previous changes and fixes :)
Image

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Bohémond
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Tue Dec 28, 2010 12:51 am

Issue B3; Units

-Various units (ID 1222, 1223, 1224, 1225, 1226, 1227, 1257, 1258, 1259, 1260, 1288, 1289, 1290, 1291, 1321, 1322, 1399, 1400, 1477, 1478, 1479, 1480, 1481, 1482, 1483, 1484, 1485, 2545, 2546, 2796, 3232, 3233) have wrong Color Parameter.

Fixed

Issue C6; Models

-Various models (ID 759, 2579, 2520, 2770, 3206, 3207, 3437, 3438, 3439) have wrong Color Parameter.

Fixed

To be included in next NCP Database Issues Release

Regards

Bohémond

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Bohémond
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Tue Dec 28, 2010 3:34 pm

Issue C7 ; Models

-Model FriedrichWilhelm4 (ID 2963) has wrong imageID parameter (i.e. symbol_general_1). This has been corrected to symbol_general_3 according to Leader Rank Parameter.

To be included in next NCP Database Issue Release.

Regards

Bohémond

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Bohémond
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Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:42 am

Issue C8 ; Models

Changes due to HvyArty/MedArty/LightArty DB modifications are not listed below as there are not issues


Models ID 1250 and ID 1252 have wrong Image ID parameter

Some models ( ID 284, 285, 286, 287, 288, 289, 1057, 1058, 1138) have wrong Family parameter

Several models (D 27,82, 90,

101,235,236,238,239,240,241,242,243, 244, 245,

246,269,270,271,276,296, 301,

302,303,304,305,306,307,308,309,310,311,312,358,371,386,398,

399, 400, 401, 402, 403, 404, 405, 406, 411, 412, 413, 414,

415, 416, 417, 418, 419, 420, 421, 688, 689, 690, 691, 692,

693, 694, 695, 696, 697, 828, 844, 845, 846, 847,867, 868,

869,870, 872, 873, 878, 879, 880,881,882,883,884, 896,909,936,

937, 991,992,993,994,995,999, 1000, 1001, 1005, 1008, 1011,

1012, 1013, 1014, 1015, 1016, 1025, 1027,

1028,1029,1030,1031,1032,1033,1034,1035, 1061,1065, 1109, 1113,

1124, 1125, 1126, 1127, 1128, 1129, 1130,1133,1134, 1145, 1146,

1147, 1148, 1149, 1150, 1151, 1168,1198, 1199, 1222, 1226,

1238, 1241, 1242, 1257, 1258,1259,1260,1288,

1289,1290,1291,1299, 1316, 1317,1318,1319,1320,1321,1322,1324,

1325, 1326, 1327,1357, 1358, 1359, 1373, 1374,1387, 1391,

1392,1394,1395,1396,1397,1398,1400,1406, 1407, 1409,1417, 1418,

1419,1423, 1430, 1436, 1437,1457,1460, 1461,1462, 1476,1477,

1478,1479,1480,1481, 1482,1483,1484,1485,1499,1516,1517,1526) have wrong FamilyType Parameter. Fixed. Most of them have no impact in gameplay as they are ship units ( cannot be "combined") or single model unit.

To be included in next DB issue release.

Regards

Bohémond

Omnius
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Will Light Artillery get Replacements?

Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:47 pm

Bohemond,
I'm a tad puzzled by your comment about the artillery differentiations being fine. I hope that means you've corrected the artillery so that light artillery replacement elements actually get used by damaged light artillery units and the same for heavy artillery. I also hope that medium artillery replacements don't get sucked into fortress artillery as it happens now as that is rather frustrating. Looking forward to the new patch with your numerous database and event fixes! :thumbsup:

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Bohémond
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Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:22 pm

Omnius,

My comment about arty diffenrentiations should be clearer, you are right.

What I want to say it's that arty differentiation belongs to NCP DB modification thread not to NCP DB Issues thread so I do not list changes in this thread. My tests results for Arty differentiation are good, no more MedArty replacements for Siege, Coastal and Fort Arty units and the Light Arty units use LightArty Replacements, useless before the modification.

I will continue testing until end of the month.


Regards

Bohémond

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Bohémond
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Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:05 am

Issue B4 ; Units

Some units (Pontooners) ( ID 228, 392, 857, 968, 1078, 1313,1366,1450) have wrong FamilyType Parmeter. No impact in gameplay as they are single model units.


Issue D1 ; Graphics

Added Units and Army pictures for FRA_Thiebault, FRA_Michel, FRA_Desolle, unit_FRA_Fessinet, POL_Rozniecki (Thank you, Nikel).

Regards

Bohémond

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Nikel
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Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:37 pm

Thanks to you! :w00t:


By the way, what happened with the Peninsular War scenario, that is where you started?

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Bohémond
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Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:40 pm

Nikel,

The Peninsular War scenario mod is on my HardDisk, but I did it using the dirty of modding ( by passing the xls files) so it's useless now.

It's possible that one day I will rework on it, starting from scrath, but the Database, events and AI need a lot of work until a long campaign like this one could be ''enjoyable'' for me.

It was my first attemp to mod with AGE engine, I was too ambitious and didn't know enough '' las tripas'' of it.

Regards

Bohémond

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Nikel
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Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:47 pm

OK, thanks for the answer :)

Rework starting from scratch...? Hmmm...


And what about creating a completely new game about it? :neener:

Perhaps the developers of RUS can comment on this expericence



Highway to Madrid sketch map. Even bigger map is needed though :D

http://www.napoleongames.com/images/Mapa%20Peninsula.pdf

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Bohémond
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Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:24 am

Nikel,

IMHO making a new game based on AGE Engine will take around two years with at least 3 members in the team ( Graphic, Historical Data and Event, Database and AI) maybe not all of them at full time.

If I can do it, a ver si me toca el gordo :D , my option will be to do it for the carolengian era (771-843).

I like the way the first Mount&Blade did it, selling the beta game at low price and price increasing as the beta came close to gold. Don't know if it's a good financial way to do games but the players contribution was impressive and no one complain about having bought a game that seems to be a beta, i.e. not finish, because everyone knew it was a beta.

Regards

Bohémond

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Nikel
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Location: Expaña

Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:55 am

Si te toca la lotería, entonces seguro que no creas ningún juego :)


¿Los carolingios?

Hmm, nada que no consigo ninguna de las dos PW, la del Peloponeso y la Peninsular :wacko:

Saludos.


Pd:sorry for posting in spanish :neener:

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Pocus
Posts: 24759
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Location: Lyon (France)

Mon Jan 17, 2011 2:50 pm

Don't continue, I have difficulties reading it :)

Seriously Bohémond, we can coordinate with you to improve NCP... without anybody having to spend 2 years on that! This would be more productive than to restart from scratch on another subject, don't you think so?
Image


Hofstadter's Law: "It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's law."

Omnius
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Making Artillery Right

Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:03 pm

Bohemond,
It sounds like you're doing to artillery what I was hoping you'd do by giving them the proper classifications they should have had from the beginning. I'm really anxious to see how the artillery replacements work in the new patch, but would rather be patient and wait for more of your corrections to be made. :D

Omnius
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Making NCP Better

Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:06 pm

Pocus,
I wouldn't get too excited by Bohemond thinking out loud responding to Nikel's comment about starting from scratch. I'm sure both know that starting over would be far more time consuming than taking NCP and making it better. Besides the work done to improve NCP will be work done for NCP2. ;)

Omnius
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Missing Unit

Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:25 pm

Not sure where this fits in but when playing the 1805 Thames or Danube scenario I noticed that when the messages that said I had a Prussian supply unit unlocked in Warsaw it actually was in Thorn. Also noticed that the Prussian river barge unit that was supposed to unlock at Warsaw was nonexistent. Probably not much can be done to fix these little booboos and there seems to be little play balance consequence to them being in the wrong place or missing. Actually having the supply unit at Thorn makes for a shorter overland trip to Danzig which means less loss of men. :neener:

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Bohémond
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Clariication for non spanish speakers

Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:34 pm

Hello,

Just a quick clarification for non spanish speaker, the conversation with Nikel was about a project if I get enough money and time, i.e. winning at loto.

So keep improving NCP.

Regards

Bohémond

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Bohémond
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Re Missing Unit

Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:43 pm

Omnius ;

I have not work yet on events based on Prussian joining Coalition Side in 1805 Thames or Danube scenario. IMHO Prussian units should not be on map at start (Setup files) but should appear after the related event. This is on my To Do list.


Regards

Bohémond

Omnius
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Leave Prussians on Map

Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:33 pm

Bohemond,
While it may make the 1805 Thames or Danube scenario look cleaner by taking the Prussians off the map until unlocked by events I'm not so sure taking them off the map at the start in the scenario setup is desired. Without the Prussians, like Blucher sitting on Magdeburg, defending their forts and cities it would be a piece of cake for a French player to invade Prussia and take some important city they should appear at. I'd say leave them on the map to start and just add the barge and move the supply to Warsaw. :cool:

Omnius
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1815 Waterloo Scenario Fix

Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:36 pm

Bohemond,
Would it be too much trouble to remove the two element supply unit from the French 1st Cavalry Corps division in the 1815 Waterloo scenario and just have it separate like every other supply unit in a corps? When dividing up that unit the supply unit ends up looking like an infantry unit on the unit picture instead of having the supply symbol. I thought that corps didn't have supply so was breaking it up.

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Bohémond
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Re Leave Prussians on Map

Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:48 pm

Omnius,

As Prussia is not at war with French Side before the related event fires, French (or Coalition Side) cannot enter Prussian regions as they are blockaded ( BlockState = 1 or 2). So no French invasion of Prussia before Prussia declares war.

I will suggest to open a new thread '' NCP Setup&Scenario Issues'' where all these kind of issue (like the other one for 1815 Scenario) can be collect. Don't you mind do it ?

It will be helpful when time to correct them will come.

Regards

Boémond

Omnius
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NCP Setup & Scenario Issues

Tue Jan 18, 2011 3:55 pm

Bohemond,
Thanks for the quick update that the French can't invade Prussia prior to a declaration of war event gets played. Yeah taking the Prussians off the map to start would seem like a good idea by providing less distraction with superfluous units.

Great idea about setting up a new thread for NCP Setup and Scenario Issues, consider it a done deal as soon as I finish this post. :cool:

Omnius
Lieutenant Colonel
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Location: Salinas, CA

Map Issue

Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:14 pm

I'm not sure if this has been reported and fixed but the Austerlitz region is in the wrong place. According to all my maps of the 1805 masterpiece battle Austerlitz is southeast of Brunn yet on the map it appears to the northwest. Even had the Coalition been able to turn Napoleon's right flank and cut his retreat route to Vienna he still could have retired to the northwest to Brunn. It would be great if the region to the southeast of Brunn were renamed Austerlitz and the former region known as Austerlitz gets renamed though I'm not sure what would be appropriate. Hopefully someone who lives near that region will know of an appropriate name based on some well known city or town there.

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